rmgill Posted April 5 Share Posted April 5 (edited) 7 hours ago, Stuart Galbraith said: Yeah, I for one would love to know what documents Berger stole. And yes, he should undoubtedly have done jail time for it. I think they gave Trump, many, many occasions to come clean on the documents. Every time he demurred, right up until the FBI knocked on the door. By contrast Biden announced he had documents off his own bat, didnt have many of them, and helped the investigation. Berger didn't exactly come clean immediately. Yet he pled to a misdemeanor when it was clearly an illegal felonious event. The Mens Rea of stuffing the documents into his clothing and hiding them at a construction site when he was 'taking a break' is quite substantial. He was destroying documents that he didn't want anyone to see. Trump was being an inflated ego and just wanted trophies to wave around. Biden, what was he doing when he stored the documents at that Chinese associated facility? HE didn't have the legal power to take that stuff home either. Lets not forget that General Petraeus handed over a document with references to classified information itself a problem to a reporter and was not charged with a crime at all. Then there's Hillary who deliberately mishandled and stored classified documents and didn't come clean at all. She was NEVER charged for anything. The fact that Trump's case is the only one that resulted in Felony charges is peculiar. 7 hours ago, Stuart Galbraith said: Its something different to find a few loose documents hiding at the back of cupboards (and im sure you find extrenious stuff every time you tidy up), its another thing entirely to fit out your entire bathroom and stage in your luxury mansion with classified documents, and fibbing to investigators about it. You mean like turning a bathroom into a server closet for the off books email server that you put classified information on and then hide from everyone when it comes out that you're sending emails from an insecure Office 365 server outside of the .gov email domain? Again, heck of a lot more security to get onto Mar A Lago than there is to hit an insecure server with self signed certificates. Any kid with basic script kiddie knowledge could access that. 7 hours ago, Stuart Galbraith said: The thing that scares me is not the documents they found. What scares me is what was in the ones they didnt? Again, who was handling security for Biden's offices he had stuff when he wasn't there? Noone with classified clearances. Secret service that are at Mar A Lago have clearance. And not just anyone can go into Mar a Lago without getting a good once over by the Secret Service. I know people who have been there. Edited April 5 by rmgill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17thfabn Posted April 5 Share Posted April 5 8 hours ago, Stuart Galbraith said: Yeah, I for one would love to know what documents Berger stole. And yes, he should undoubtedly have done jail time for it. I thought Berger's actions beyond being criminal were incredibly stupid. Surly the government had copies of what he tried to steal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted April 5 Share Posted April 5 Probably not, not of documents that are classified secret anyway. I read something the other day about our national archive, good as it is, reckons it only gets something like 20 to 30 percent of all documents produced. I would guess your government is no different, particularly in the digital age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmgill Posted April 5 Share Posted April 5 He appeared to be, over the course of several incidents attempting to expunge the documents entirely by surreptitious and illegal means. He didn't take one copy. He methodically gained access to 5 different copies and destroyed each. He was cleaning up for the Clintons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted April 5 Share Posted April 5 Course he was, that much is clear. Quite what he was clearing up, that is the question mark. Well, probably he CIA or NSA have records stashed away. It won't be secret forever, even if all the presidential documents have been purged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ssnake Posted April 5 Share Posted April 5 Clean-ups like this aren't meant to erase documents forever - a fringe bonus if that can be accomplished, but hardly necessary. Just suppress incriminating information long enough that it has no effect other than some future historian's scoop of digging up an obscure original document decades after the last one involved in a scandal has died, and the only people interested are other irrelevant academics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted April 6 Share Posted April 6 This: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmgill Posted April 16 Share Posted April 16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted April 16 Share Posted April 16 “Never fight uphill, me boys! But it was too late.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 Gettysburg 'was beautiful'. https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trumps-gettysburg-address-uphill-lee.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 (edited) Sleepy Joe sorry, Trump, has apparently fallen asleep the last two days during his trial. On the second day it was apparently long enough for the court sketch artist to draw it. Edited April 17 by Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17thfabn Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 2 hours ago, Josh said: Sleepy Joe <cough> sorry, Trump, has apparently fallen asleep the last two days during his trial. I was on a jury for a civil trial. The plaintiff's & defenses lawyers asked all the potential jurors the same questions . I was one of the first choosen. I had to sit and listen as they asked the same questions over and over. Increadably boring It took two days to pick 8 jury members plus two alternative jurors. I could see why the Trumpster would nod off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 1 hour ago, 17thfabn said: I was on a jury for a civil trial. The plaintiff's & defenses lawyers asked all the potential jurors the same questions . I was one of the first choosen. I had to sit and listen as they asked the same questions over and over. Increadably boring It took two days to pick 8 jury members plus two alternative jurors. I could see why the Trumpster would nod off. Perhaps, but it is still a bad look. I doubt it is typical of most defendants in a criminal trial, even if jurors are less excited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 5 hours ago, Josh said: Sleepy Joe sorry, Trump, has apparently fallen asleep the last two days during his trial. On the second day it was apparently long enough for the court sketch artist to draw it. Have you ever sat through a trial? OMFG it can get boring as lawyers split hairs, and repeat the same question 96 different ways. Heck I have been on the witness stand and have gotten sleepy. We actually had a bailiff fall asleep during a trial once. His snoring broke up the jury in giggles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17thfabn Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 1 hour ago, Josh said: Perhaps, but it is still a bad look. I doubt it is typical of most defendants in a criminal trial, even if jurors are less excited. True it is a bad look. I have no doubt that CBS, ABC, NBC, CNN, NPR , The Washington Post, The NY Times etc. Will play it for all it is worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17thfabn Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 (edited) 1 hour ago, Murph said: Have you ever sat through a trial? OMFG it can get boring as lawyers split hairs, and repeat the same question 96 different ways. Heck I have been on the witness stand and have gotten sleepy. We actually had a bailiff fall asleep during a trial once. His snoring broke up the jury in giggles. It is disappointing seeing a trial live. No Perry Mason moments. No law and order sound track. No elegant lawyers from LA Law or Suits. Edited April 17 by 17thfabn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 (edited) 12 minutes ago, 17thfabn said: True it is a bad look. I have no doubt that CBS, ABC, NBC, CNN, NPR , The Washington Post, The NY Times etc. Will play it for all it is worth. As would Fox News, Breitbart, OANN, Newsmax, etc were things reversed. I personally am still amazed that on the night after Arizona invoked an 1864 law, Fox News brought it up not once in their prime time shows. That event was not just dunking on an old man candidate, which both sides have seen fit as their front man: that was a CNN massive repercussion of the end of Roe v Wade. Suddenly Fox does not want to mention that, and suddenly no AZ republicans want to publicly back it… Edited April 17 by Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 1 hour ago, Murph said: Have you ever sat through a trial? OMFG it can get boring as lawyers split hairs, and repeat the same question 96 different ways. Heck I have been on the witness stand and have gotten sleepy. We actually had a bailiff fall asleep during a trial once. His snoring broke up the jury in giggles. How many defendants have you witnessed fall asleep? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivanhoe Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 Strangely, nobody "called a lid" at 10 am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17thfabn Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 1 hour ago, Ivanhoe said: Strangely, nobody "called a lid" at 10 am. ? Meaning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmgill Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 Meaning Biden was campaigning for a few hours each day the LAST go around and would retire at 10am. His energy levels allowed working to 10am. As in NOTHING more from the Biden campaign that day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 (edited) 8 hours ago, 17thfabn said: It is disappointing seeing a trial live. No Perry Mason moments. No law and order sound track. No elegant lawyers from LA Law or Suits. I dont know if you remember the OJ Trial, but that really isnt my experience. Although no, he didnt brutally knife anyone to death. But it would still be fun to watch him nod off. I served on jury service. It really was just like Rumpole of the Bailey. Edited April 18 by Stuart Galbraith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 15 hours ago, Josh said: How many defendants have you witnessed fall asleep? None, during trial, but a couple did nod off during jury selection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Fredriksson Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 14 minutes ago, Murph said: None, during trial, but a couple did nod off during jury selection. Which only shows how truly special Donald Trump is! Winning! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmgill Posted April 18 Share Posted April 18 They’re in Jury selection now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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