2nd Hungarian-Romanian war

[Jaroslav]

Hello mates. I'll start with another scenario. The crisis arose in 1990, but fortunately it did not escalate into a war. As before, I will slowly put together the data and as before, feel free to join. An interesting event to play.

[Jaroslav]

Soon after the demise of the Communist regimes in Hungary and Romania, in March 1990, violent ethnic clashes in Transylvania strained the relationship between both countries to the brink of war. As a result, the first Open Skies Treaty in the world to mutually assess the strength and disposition of opposing military forces was worked out and became effective in 1992. This is considered a direct precursor of the 2002 multilateral Treaty on Open Skies that once included Russia and the United States.[37][38]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungary–Romania_relations

[Jaroslav]

The ethnic clashes of Târgu Mureș (also called Black March, Hungarian: Fekete Március)[1] refer to incidents between the Hungarians and Romanians in Târgu Mureș and surrounding settlements in Transylvania, Romania in March 1990. The clashes were the bloodiest inter-ethnic incidents of the post-communist era in Transylvania.[2] Târgu Mureș (Hungarian: Marosvásárhely) is a Romanian town with an ethnically mixed population that was almost equally distributed between Romanians and Hungarians after the fall of the communist regime in December 1989. It has been a cultural and political center for the Hungarian minority in Transylvania.[3]

In March 1990, clashes occurred there between the two ethnic groups in the town, involving ethnic Romanians from neighbouring villages. The clashes left 5 people dead and 300 injured.[2] The riots were broadcast nationally on Romanian television and were covered by media around the world.

The exact cause is still widely disputed. The roles of the media and the Romanian government are also questioned.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_clashes_of_Târgu_Mureș

[Jaroslav]

[Jaroslav]

[Jaroslav]

[Jaroslav]

HUNGARY

TOTAL ARMED FORCES:
ACTIVE: 94,000 (50,500 conscripts).
Terms of service: 18 months.
RESERVES: 134,400: Army: 125,000; Avn 9,400 (to age 55).

ARMY: 72,000 (42,500 conscripts) incl Danube Flotilla.
   1 Army, 3 Corps HQ: each Corps with 1 tk, 3 MR, 1 arty bde, 1 SA-6 regt.
   Army tps: 1 arty, 1 Scud, 1 SA-4 bde; 1 ATK, 1 AD arty, 1 AB bn.
   (2 tk, 2 MR bde at Cat A, remainder Cat B.)
EQUIPMENT:
MBT: some 1,516: some 1,287 T-54/-55M, 138 T-72, 91 T-34 (in store).
RECCE: 500: some 160 BRDM-2.
AIFV: 542 BMP-1 (502).
APC: 1,816 (CFE: 1,311): 140 BTR-50/-60/-80 (31), 386 Fug D-442 (177) 1,223 PSZH D-944 (1,072), 67 MT-LB (31).
TOTAL CFE ARTY: 1,084:
TOWED: 594: 122mm: 235 M-1938 (M-30); 152mm: 51 M-1943 (D-1), 308 D-20.
SP: 172: 122mm: 154 2S1; 152mm: 18 2S3.
MRL: 122mm: 58 BM-21.
MORTARS: 120mm: 260.
SSM: launchers: 18 FROG-7, 9 Scud.
ATGW: 312: 117 AT-3 Sagger (incl BRDM-2 SP), 21 AT-4 Spigot, 174 AT-5 Spandrel.
ATK GUNS: 85mm: 163 D-44; 100mm: 106 MT-12.
AD GUNS: 23mm: 14 ZSU-23-4 SP; 57mm: 144 S-60.
SAM: 110: 18 SA-4, 44 SA-6, 44 SA-9, 4 SA-13; plus 240 SA-7, 54 SA-14.
DANUBE FLOTILLA:
MCMV: 6 Nestin MSI (riverine); boats.

AIR FORCE: 22,000 (8,000 conscripts); 87 cbt ac, 64 armed hel.
   1 air div:
FIGHTER:
   2 regt with 50 MiG-21bis.
   1 sqn with 10 MiG-23MF.
RECCE: 1 sqn with 11 Su-22.
TRANSPORT: 2 An-24, 9 An-26.
HELICOPTERS: 2 regt.
   1 ATK/tpt:
   2 sqn with 39 Mi-24.
   1 sqn with 25 Mi-8/-17;
   1 tpt with 23 Mi-8.
TRAINING: 22 *MiG-21, 2 *MiG-23, 3 *Su-22, 4 Z-43.
AAM: AA-2 Atoll.
AD: 1 div: 3 SAM regt, some 20 sites: 120 SA-2/-3.

FORCES ABROAD:
IRAN/IRAQ: (UNIIMOG): 15 Observers.

PARA-MILITARY:
BORDER GUARDS: (Ministry of Interior) 18,000 (13,500 conscripts); 11 districts.
CONSTRUCTION TROOPS: (Ministry of Defence) 7,900 (7,300 conscripts).
CIVIL DEFENCE: 700 (60 conscripts).

FOREIGN FORCES:
USSR: Southern Group of Forces: Army: 1 TD, 2 MRD. Ain 2 FGA, 2 ftr regt. (To be withdrawn by June 1991.)

[Jaroslav]

RUMANIA

TOTAL ARMED FORCES:
ACTIVE: 163,000 (107,500 conscripts).
Terms of service: Army, Air Force 12 months; Navy 24 months.
RESERVES: 203,000: Army 178,000; Navy 6,000; Air 19,000.

ARMY: 126,000 (95,000 conscripts).
4 Army Areas:
   1 with 1 TD, 2 MRD;
   1 with 1 TD, 1 MRD;
   1 with 3 MRD;
   1 with 2 MRD.
(Cat A: 1 TD, 1 MRD. Cat B: 1 TD, 3 MRD. Cat C 4 MRD.)
Army tps:
   3 mtn bde/regt.
   2 arty bde/regt.
   1 ATK bde (5 regt).
   4 AA bde; 2 AA, 3 SA-6 regt.
   2 Scurf bde.
   4 AB regt.
EQUIPMENT:
MBT: 2,817 incl 1,060 T-34, 757 T-55, 30 T-72, 556 TR-80, 414 TR-580 (T-10).
ASSAULT GUN: 430 (CFE HACV): 326 SU-76, 84 SU-100, 20 ISU-152.
RECCE: 650 BRDM-1/-2.
AIFV: 127 MLI-84.
APC: 2, 572: 28 BTR-40, 50 BTR-60, 156 TAB-77, 387 TABC-79, 1,912 TAB-71, 39 MLVM (MT-LB).
TOTAL CFE ARTY: 3, 803.
TOWED: 1,549: 100mm: 268 Skoda (various models); 105mm: 87 Schneider; 122mm: 496 M-1938 (M-30), 14 M-1931/37 (A-19); 130mm: 138 Gun 8Z;
   150mm: 128 Skoda (Model 1934), 6 Ceh (Model 1937); 152mm: 85 D-20, 10 Gun-How 85, 61 Model 1938, 256 Model 81.
SP: 18: 122mm: 6 2S1, 12 Model 89.
MRL: 532: 122mm: 134 APR-21, 290 APR-40; 130mm: 108 R-2.
MORTARS: 1,704: 120mm: 1, 126 M-120 516 Model 1982; 160mm: 50 M-160; 240mm: 12 M-240.
SSM: launchers: 32 Frog, 18 Scud.
ATGW: 400: AT-1 Snapper, AT-3 Sagger (incl BRDM-2 SP).
ATK GUNS: 300: 57mm: M-1943; 85mm: D-44; 100mm: T-12.
AD GUNS: 400: 30mm; 37mm; 57mm; 85mm; 100mm.
SAM: SA-7, 160 SA-6.

NAVY: 9,000 (2,500 conscripts). Black Sea Fleet, Danube Sqn, Coastal Defence.
BASES: Coastal: Mangalia, Constanta; Danube: Braila, Giurgiu, Sulina, Tulcea.
SUBMARINE: 1 Sov Kilo SS with 533mm TT.
PRINCIPAL SURFACE COMBATANTS: 5:
DESTROYER: 1 Muntenia DDG with SA-N-7 Gadfly SAM, plus 4x2 SS-N-2C Styx SSM, 2 IAR-316 hel, 2x3 533mm TT.
FRIGATES: 4 Tetal with 2 ASW RL, 4 ASTT.
PATROL AND COASTAL COMBATANTS: 84:
CORVETTES: 3 Sov Poti ASW with 2 ASW RL, 4 533mm TT.
MISSILE CRAFT: 6 Sov Osa PFM with 4 SS-N-2A Styx.
TORPEDO: 42:
   12 Epitrop PFT with 4 533mm TT.
   26 Ch Huchuan PHT with 2 533mm TT.
   4 Ch P-4 PFT<, with 2 457mm TT.
PATROL 33:
   OFFSHORE: 4 Democratia (GDR M-40) PCO.
   COASTAL: 2 Sov Kronshtadt PCC.
   INSHORE: 6 Ch Shanghai PFI.
   RIVERINE: 21: 3 Brutar with 1 100mm gun, 18<.
MINE WARFARE: 42:
MINELAYERS: 2 Cosar, capacity 200 mines.
MCM: 40:
   2 Musca MSC.
   12 T.301 MSI.
   26 VD141 MSI<.
SUPPORT AND MISCELLANEOUS: 10: 2 Croitor log spt/tenders (hel deck), 3 spt tankers, 2 AGOR, 1 trg, 2 tugs.

COASTAL DEFENCE (2,000): HQ Constanta.
4 sectors:
   10 coastal arty bty with some 100 130mm, 150mm and 152mm guns.
   Some 8 bty of AA arty reported; eqpt unknown.
   Would get 1 regt of naval inf on mob.

AIR FORCE: 28,000 (10,000 conscripts); 370 cbt ac, no armed hel.
   3 air div: 7 cbt regt:
FGA: 6 sqn with 60 MiG-17, 50 IAR-93.
FIGHTER: 15 sqn:
   3 with 45 MiG-23;
   12 with 185 MiG-21F/PF/U,
TRANSPORT: 1 regt with 10 An-2, 11 An-24, 8 An-26, 3 Il-14, 5 Li-2.
SURVEY: 3 An-30.
HELICOPTERS: 2 regt plus 3 sqn with 55 IAR-316B, 40 IAR-330, Mi-2, 10 Mi-4, 25 Mi-8.
TRAINING: 40 IAR-823, 10 IAR-28, 15 *IAR-93, 40 L-29, 35 L-39, 10 MiG-15, 15 *MiG-21.
AAM: AA-2 Atoll, AA-7 Apex.
AD: 1 div: 20 SAM sites with 135 SA-2.

PARA-MILITARY:
BORDER GUARDS: (Ministry of Defence): 815,000; 26 Ch Shanghai II PH.
SECURITY TROOPS (Ministry of Defence): ~30,000 (status unclear).
PATRIOTIC GUARD (R): some 30,000 (status unclear).

[Jaroslav]

Good source for OOB is here

but I will post it seperatly for each country

[old_goat]

It is fornunate that such war didnt happen. Hungary didnt even had the slightest chance. The equipment was there, but the vast majority of the army was incredibly poorly trained and demoralized. Especially the infantry, alcoholism was widespread everywhere. The leadership was totally incompetent. Some branches of the army could be called properly trained (air force, air defence, tankists) but the rest was simply hopeless.

[Jaroslav]

2 hours ago, old_goat said:

It is fornunate that such war didnt happen. Hungary didnt even had the slightest chance. The equipment was there, but the vast majority of the army was incredibly poorly trained and demoralized. Especially the infantry, alcoholism was widespread everywhere. The leadership was totally incompetent. Some branches of the army could be called properly trained (air force, air defence, tankists) but the rest was simply hopeless.

Romanian army wasnt in beter shape either. Transilvanian geography favoured defender but Hungarian minority was large in some parts, infact it was majority in some places

[Jaroslav]

[Jaroslav]

[Jaroslav]

[Crazy Dutch]

 

The Book Future Wars: The World's Most Dangerous Flashpoints  from Trevor N. Dupuy has a chapter about a Hungarian Romanian War. Namely Chapter 8: The War  for Transylvania.  According the chapter the War starts on 1 October 1993 with the invasion of Romania by the Hungarian Army.

[Jaroslav]

On 10/11/2025 at 11:50 AM, Crazy Dutch said:

 

The Book Future Wars: The World's Most Dangerous Flashpoints  from Trevor N. Dupuy has a chapter about a Hungarian Romanian War. Namely Chapter 8: The War  for Transylvania.  According the chapter the War starts on 1 October 1993 with the invasion of Romania by the Hungarian Army.

Do you have it in PDF

[Jaroslav]

Hungarian army OOB

http://www.fireandfury.com/orbats/modcwhungarian.pdf

[Jaroslav]

Romanian army OOB

http://www.fireandfury.com/orbats/modcwromanian.pdf

[Jaroslav]

Hungarian air force bases

[Jaroslav]

Romanian air force bases 1989.

[Jaroslav]

Between 1977 and 1986 the Hungarian strategic SAM network underwent a significant modernization. The SA-75 Dvina was replaced with the longer-range S-75M Volkhov from 1977 to 1983. 6 Dvina sites were retained and re-equipped with the new system, while 7 new sites were constructed to house the remainder of the Volkhov batteries. By 1983 the Dvina had been completely phased out in Hungarian service, and the Volkhov system would serve until 1995. 1978 saw the introduction of the S-125M Neva SAM system, which would take residence at seven locations, serving until 1995. In 1986 the S-200VE Vega long-range SAM system was introduced at a single location. The Vega would outlast its shorter-range counterparts, serving until 1997. All of these new systems were subordinate to the same regiments that had operated the Dvina system under the old air defense architecture, the 11th, 104th, and 105th PLRPs.
https://geimint.blogspot.com/2008/10/hungarian-strategic-air-defense-cold.html?m=1

[Jaroslav]

1990: 1 Vega, 7 Neva, 12 Volkhov (map)

[Jaroslav]

Hungarian air force air defense squadrons (map is from 1973. but show us where airbases were)

[Jaroslav]

Hungarian Army Aviation
order of battle January 1, 1988

[Jaroslav]