Israel/Palestine events

[urbanoid]

9 minutes ago, NickM said:

Yes but be aware that the Druze and Maronite Christian Militias are civilans and not bound by military discipline--expect such an even to be unspeakably bloody (Tal Zataar, Sabra/Shatilla, Black September bumped up to God knows what degree).

When it happened in 1982 you had:

- external support with boots on the ground (Israel)
- much stronger position of christians in Lebanon
- shiites being basically a non-entity politically

That's why I said it won't happen now because:

- no external support if Israel doesn't put boots on the ground - preferably in ALL of the country, and they won't
- relatively far weaker position of christians in Lebanon, on every level
- shiites being the most powerful faction by far, far stronger than the central government - and they DO have external support from Iran and Syria

[urbanoid]

I knew it, Israel is a secret Polish colony! Glory to settlers!

Quote

Polish media: Tusk this, Tusk that, Kaczyński this, Kaczyński that, high prices, companies being closed, things are bad and will get worse...

Foreign crazies: Israel is a Polish-Polish condominium under Jewish trusteeship. Poles controlling Israel from the backseat banned DNA testing so that the truth about Polish colonization in the Middle East would not come to light!! And isn't it more pleasant to read?

 

Edited September 27 by urbanoid

[Roman Alymov]

2 hours ago, urbanoid said:

I knew it, Israel is a secret Polish colony! Glory to settlers!

There is a certain degree of logic in it, since without Jewish migrants from ex-Polish lands Israel would not have  been created.  There is a popular joke that all prime-ministers of Isarel got Russian Empire )(="Polish") family roots...

    As i have said many times. it is time for Russian migrants (who believe they are Jews) to return home and leave ME tribes alone....

[urbanoid]

5 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said:

There is a certain degree of logic in it, since without Jewish migrants from ex-Polish lands Israel would not have  been created.  There is a popular joke that all prime-ministers of Isarel got Russian Empire )(="Polish") family roots...

    As i have said many times. it is time for Russian migrants (who believe they are Jews) to return home and leave ME tribes alone....

Yeah, 'believe they are Jews', like some people 'believe they are Ukrainians' or whatever. Sounds like you, all right.

[Roman Alymov]

1 minute ago, urbanoid said:

Yeah, 'believe they are Jews', like some people 'believe they are Ukrainians' or whatever. Sounds like you, all right.

Yes. the nature is the same: some people believe they are Elfs, some thet they are Ukrainians, some others claim to be Jews...  Actually, apart from may be some Middle East Jews, most of European migrants to modern Israel got very little to do with populatopn of Palestine. It is like as if distant descendants of Poles from Siberia, after hundreds f not thousdands of yeras, decide to kick out "real" Poles out and reinstate "original" Poland....

https://youtu.be/SMJJiZlXOi0

 

[urbanoid]

1 minute ago, Roman Alymov said:

Yes. the nature is the same: some people believe they are Elfs, some thet they are Ukrainians, some others claim to be Jews...  Actually, apart from may be some Middle East Jews, most of European migrants to modern Israel got very little to do with populatopn of Palestine. It is like as if distant descendants of Poles from Siberia, after hundreds f not thousdands of yeras, decide to kick out "real" Poles out and reinstate "original" Poland....

https://youtu.be/SMJJiZlXOi0

 

While others delude themselves they're entitled to their empire because of some genetic links and a language that was born from common roots a millenium or more ago? Hey, why not make a 'Indo-European' empire, most of modern Europeans are descendants of Indo-Europeans and those originate from... somewhere in Central Asia? 

Somehow pretty much everyone in Europe was putting them in 'Jews' category, not *insert a name of a European nationality* category, but somehow they are Europeans now? That's how the Europeans saw things, 'from Lisbon to Vladivostok', in comparison what some ragged thirdworlders think should not be even affecting our thought processes, maybe except for the purpose of ridiculing them and calling them retards.

[crazyinsane105]

4 hours ago, urbanoid said:

When it happened in 1982 you had:

- external support with boots on the ground (Israel)
- much stronger position of christians in Lebanon
- shiites being basically a non-entity politically

That's why I said it won't happen now because:

- no external support if Israel doesn't put boots on the ground - preferably in ALL of the country, and they won't
- relatively far weaker position of christians in Lebanon, on every level
- shiites being the most powerful faction by far, far stronger than the central government - and they DO have external support from Iran and Syria

Completely agree with you. Most Lebanese Christians aren’t going to pick up arms again, not to mention a huge chunk left the country and never returned after the civil war. And obviously there won’t be external support for Lebanese Christians either, unlike that of Lebanese Shia 

[Roman Alymov]

On 9/28/2024 at 2:59 AM, urbanoid said:

While others delude themselves they're entitled to their empire because of some genetic links and a language that was born from common roots a millenium or more ago? Hey, why not make a 'Indo-European' empire, most of modern Europeans are descendants of Indo-Europeans and those originate from... somewhere in Central Asia? 

   That is not new idea, since both "pan-Slavic" and "Eurasian" ideas were circulated among thinkers for some time. Who knows, may be it will be done sometimes in distant future - who knows....

On 9/28/2024 at 2:59 AM, urbanoid said:

Somehow pretty much everyone in Europe was putting them in 'Jews' category, not *insert a name of a European nationality* category, but somehow they are Europeans now? That's how the Europeans saw things, 'from Lisbon to Vladivostok', in comparison what some ragged thirdworlders think should not be even affecting our thought processes, maybe except for the purpose of ridiculing them and calling them retards.

  First, "pretty much everyone in Europe" was very much in a business of religeous devide (even among Christians) to the degree of mass-killing each other on that basis. "Jews" are actually not standing out from "Protestants", "Catholic", "Orthodox" and smaller religeous groups (some of this groups were completely whiped out by fellow Christians, by the way, and others fled to another side of Athlantic to find relative safety among pagan tribes). More recent example is "Cossacks"  - pretty much everyone in Europe was putting them in separate category, but they were just paramilitary organisation of runaway Russian peasants to self-defend against both Nomads and states they have escaped from, be it Russia/Moscow kingdom or Poland/Lithuania.

    Second, what is the link between retired physics professor from StPete, decorated scientist and probably former Communist Party member, and what name was used in XIX century to call his distant relatives who were practicing Judaism?  Still, this man had moved to Israel and was killed in October 7th events..... What the hell was he doing in this barbaric land? 

    Third, at what point should local Arabs care about how Europeans were calling other Europeans? For them, the difference between Polish/Russian Jew and just Polish/Russian is not obvious (by the way i remember once being asked by Tunisian as if i am Jewish - probably, because of my broken nose and jeneral outlook)

 

[urbanoid]

>implying I care what local Arabs think

Since I don't see either side giving up (both have legitimate claims to the land), we can debate until we're both blue in the face.

The fact is that in general the Jews have not considered Europe to be especially friendly to them and the point of zionism was to be 'a nation like any other', the 'blood and soil' type nationalism that they learned from the Europeans as well. They don't want to be 'Jewish Poles', 'Jewish Russians' or 'Jewish Italians', they want to live on the land they claim as their own, simple as. Not all, obviously, but definitely a significant portion. 

[sunday]

25 minutes ago, urbanoid said:

The fact is that in general the Jews have not considered Europe to be especially friendly to them and the point of zionism was to be 'a nation like any other', the 'blood and soil' type nationalism that they learned from the Europeans as well. They don't want to be 'Jewish Poles', 'Jewish Russians' or 'Jewish Italians', they want to live on the land they claim as their own, simple as. Not all, obviously, but definitely a significant portion. 

Is that a fact?

Tell that to the millions living in the US.

[urbanoid]

Just now, sunday said:

Is that a fact?

Tell that to the millions living in the US.

I'd say on average the US has been much friendlier (or at least less unfriendly) to the Juice in its short history, but then again the US came to existence in a rather more 'enlightened' period. Quite a lot of them arrived to the US precisely because of pogroms and discriminatory laws in Europe, especially the Russian Empire - in just last ~40 years of its existence 2 million of them went to the other side of the pond. About half a million immigrated to the US after USSR fell too, with an additional million or so going to Israel. Maybe THEY should be asked why they don't want to live in Russia, despite Roman's sincere invitation?

 

[sunday]

So they could live happily in the US, thanks for agreeing!

[urbanoid]

Some, yes, others apparently need their own country to be happy.

[Roman Alymov]

3 hours ago, urbanoid said:

>implying I care what local Arabs think

Since I don't see either side giving up (both have legitimate claims to the land), we can debate until we're both blue in the face.

The fact is that in general the Jews have not considered Europe to be especially friendly to them and the point of zionism was to be 'a nation like any other', the 'blood and soil' type nationalism that they learned from the Europeans as well. They don't want to be 'Jewish Poles', 'Jewish Russians' or 'Jewish Italians', they want to live on the land they claim as their own, simple as. Not all, obviously, but definitely a significant portion. 

   Since when could the group of white people who happen to be unhappy about the place(s) in Europe they live in, just cross the sea and grab the land populated by local tribes?  Do you know the story of Nekrasov Cossacks, by the way? In short, the big group (~500 families) of Don Cossacks, after the supression of Kondrat Bulavin uprising in 1709, have moved  into Ottoman Empire. Ignat Nekrasov was their first ataman (elected military leader) and legendary he left Cossacls the  testament to "not return to Russia as long as it is ruled by Tsar". For 240 years, they were staying there, living among Turks but mostly not mixing with them, staying Christians and speaking Russian. Only in Soviet time, in 1962, about 200 families have finally returned to Russia (USSR) from Turkey (also, few dozens of families left to USA and one family stayed in Turkey). Note that despite of all comlexities between Russians and Turks (who are, let's say, not angels to minorities) this people have somehow managed to coexist with locals without genocide and bombings....

 

[Roman Alymov]

2 hours ago, urbanoid said:

Some, yes, others apparently need their own country to be happy.

The logical question for Arans to ask is "Why here? If Polish Jews are unhappy about life in Poland, why not they grab the part of Poland to build own state there? Why have they came here, on another continent?"

[urbanoid]

2 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said:

The logical question for Arans to ask is "Why here? If Polish Jews are unhappy about life in Poland, why not they grab the part of Poland to build own state there? Why have they came here, on another continent?"

Well, I'm neither giving up parts of Poland to anyone nor am I answering Arab questions - not my circus, not my monkeys.

State of Israel is a fact of life and their Juice generally don't consider themselves Polish, Russian or whatever nation they (or their ancestors) originate from. The Israeli nationality is also a fact of life. 

Yes, sometimes nations are created (or recreated) even after a long absence. Sometimes it takes less time, after all there was no 'Palestinian' nationality either and early 'Palestinians', including their leadership, have considered themselves simply Arabs. Just like... many other Arabs who today live in various Arab countries that have not existed even a century ago. 

[urbanoid]

Anyway, there's a whole twitter shitstorm with different thirdworldist/pro-Russian/anti-Western accounts autistically screeching about how Israel is Polish in general and Bibi in particular. All ot once, I'm sure totally by accident, totally not coordinated by some 'retard HQ'.

Well, at least the memes are good.

^ 'Everything' in Polish

Quote

 

Polish media: Tusk this, Tusk that, Kaczyński this, Kaczyński that, high prices, companies being closed, things are bad and will get worse...

Foreign crazies: Israel is a Polish-Polish condominium under Jewish trusteeship. Poles controlling Israel from the backseat banned DNA testing so that the truth about Polish colonization in the Middle East would not come to light!!

 

[Roman Alymov]

1 hour ago, urbanoid said:

Anyway, there's a whole twitter shitstorm with different thirdworldist/pro-Russian/anti-Western accounts autistically screeching about how Israel is Polish in general and Bibi in particular. All ot once, I'm sure totally by accident, totally not coordinated by some 'retard HQ'.

Well, at least the memes are good.

^ 'Everything' in Polish

 

Well, the fact you are excited about it is indication of how Polish, Jewish and Russian cultures are simmilar

 

"There was post-“Perestroyka” anecdote in Russia: Old Jew was asked “Why are you buying and reading all this anti-Semitic newspapers?” - “Because I enjoy reading articles on how all-mighty Jews secretly rule the world”. The same here – Russians may be enjoying reading stories about “US President is KGB agent”, but it is not making this stories true."

[urbanoid]

1 minute ago, Roman Alymov said:

Well, the fact you are excited about it is indication of how Polish, Jewish and Russian cultures are simmilar

 

"There was post-“Perestroyka” anecdote in Russia: Old Jew was asked “Why are you buying and reading all this anti-Semitic newspapers?” - “Because I enjoy reading articles on how all-mighty Jews secretly rule the world”. The same here – Russians may be enjoying reading stories about “US President is KGB agent”, but it is not making this stories true."

I think the origin of that joke might be 1930s Germany, only in that version an old Jew was reading Der Sturmer. 

[Roman Alymov]

2 minutes ago, urbanoid said:

I think the origin of that joke might be 1930s Germany, only in that version an old Jew was reading Der Sturmer. 

I'm affraid it is much older than that. After all, Nazis have not invented anything - just used old moods and stories, giving them industrial power of modern state. 

[urbanoid]

Good question indeed!

 

 

[rmgill]

On 9/29/2024 at 12:02 PM, sunday said:

Is that a fact?

Tell that to the millions living in the US.

That's because we don't give them grief for having a Mezuzah on their door. 

More seriously, I'm wondering if the Longshoreman Strike is going to impact any shipments to Israel or if the Military shipments will be excepted. 

[crazyinsane105]

4 hours ago, rmgill said:

That's because we don't give them grief for having a Mezuzah on their door. 

More seriously, I'm wondering if the Longshoreman Strike is going to impact any shipments to Israel or if the Military shipments will be excepted. 

Military shipments won’t be impacted. Quite sure whatever logistical system the USN uses will be utilized 

[rmgill]

I rather expect tit's longshoremen who handle the lines and run the cranes. But they may have a separate contract with MSC. BUT if it's going on normal shipping or a special shipment, then that may not be the case. And the ports themselves are closed down. It could be routed through MOTSU (Military Ocean Terminal Sunny Point). I wonder if Port of Baltimore or Port of Savannah even handle explosive cargos like munitions or not. 

Probably an OPSEC issue where these are actually routed. 

[lucklucky]