Yama Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 27 minutes ago, ink said: Yeah, I'm with Stuart on this one I'm afraid. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I seriously doubt there ever is a meeting of 40 SAS operatives, anywhere (unless it's like a service veteran drinking event held at boathouse in Hereford), certainly not in a foreign country and close proximity of active frontline. Any larger scale meets between Western advisers or special forces are likely to held in some bunker in Kiev, or Lviv, or really off-country. I could believe that like 1 or 2 might have been caught and got killed (and something like that may have indeed happened at some point during the war). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ink Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Yama said: I seriously doubt there ever is a meeting of 40 SAS operatives, anywhere (unless it's like a service veteran drinking event held at boathouse in Hereford), certainly not in a foreign country and close proximity of active frontline. It certainly wouldn't be prudent (and I very much doubt it happens) but spec ops of all flavours do have form when it comes to not always being prudent. In all likelihood, this above event never happened. But if it somehow crazily did, I can imagine that there might have been some false sense of security. After all, Russia isn't able to bomb all of Ukraine all the time and I imagine huge swathes of the country probably seem rather peaceful. Edited July 24 by ink Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Kotsch Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 1 hour ago, alejandro_ said: Col Gen Oleksandr Syrskyi: ... Russian tanks has “doubled” – from 1,700 to 3,500. Artillery systems have tripled, and armoured personnel carriers gone up from 4,500 to 8,900. ... This makes me thoughtful. Why don't we see this tremendous power on the battlefield? The statement contradicts everything we have seen so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavel Novak Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 1 hour ago, Roman Alymov said: So now pro-Ukrainians (and their Western masters) acknowlege original Ris Army force was about 100k (combined with about 20-30K of DNR and LNR units it will be somewhere close to original estimation of 120-130K, 150K in other estimations). Probably it worth reminding that UkrArmy alone in 2021 was 260K (double the Russian forces number), including 170K land forces + trained reserve of about 300K of "ATO veterans" and all sorts of Azov and other paramilitaries. Now they have about 1300K armed men in their "defence forces". Effectively, it means pro-Russians were always outnumbered at least 2:1, and before "partial mobilization" reaching 3:1 to 5:1 . I wonder how Western MSM still amnage to print something like "His unenviable task is to defeat a bigger Russian army." Note it was well known in Rus TG for a long time Again you are counting apples and oranges. That russian number means combat troops only* but ukr numbers are total including rear area services. *Though numbers for DNR/LNR are probably including their rear area services but lot of that was provided by russian forces anyway. In total numbers Russia has now significant superiority in both combat troops strength and rear are services which are primarily deployed in Russia proper (i.e. not on territory legaly belonging to Ukraine as Russia recognized in the past). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Alymov Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 1 hour ago, alejandro_ said: “When it comes to equipment, there is a ratio of 1:2 or 1:3 in their favour,” he said. Since 2022 the number of Russian tanks has “doubled” – from 1,700 to 3,500. Artillery systems have tripled, and armoured personnel carriers gone up from 4,500 to 8,900. Exactly as it was stated in my post in another thread on storage yards becoming empty - seems like, as i have said, restored equipment is not lost completely but at least part of it is going to new units Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Alymov Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 10 minutes ago, Pavel Novak said: Again you are counting apples and oranges. That russian number means combat troops only* but ukr numbers are total including rear area services. I'm sorry but i do not see it stated in this quote. Contary to that, Russian regular units have entered the war with severe shortage of "combat troops" - see all this BMPs without infantry etc. That was the reason of many heavy weapons systems lost -there was simply not enough infantry to guard them even against light infantry/militia attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Alymov Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 47 minutes ago, Stefan Kotsch said: This makes me thoughtful. Why don't we see this tremendous power on the battlefield? The statement contradicts everything we have seen so far. How you expect to see it? Despite of impression of plenty of reports, what you actually see is pro-Ukr videos of successfull drone attacks (for obvious reasons, unsuccessful ones are not shown). Most of armor from both sides is not present on battlefield at all, but is hidden well away of FPV/artillery reach (it is 20-40 km), pro-Ukr tanks are only seen when things actually going badly - see another M1 Abrams killed today as 47th briigade was trying to assist two encercled btns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavel Novak Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 (edited) I am not saying that original russian invasion strength was fine. It wasn't and it would work only if there was no organized resistance from ukr army. What I am saying is that if you say that ukr army has 1.3M people in army you need to understand that this is uncluding clercks, kitchen personel etc. Thus comparing this number only to russian troops deployed in Ukraine gives wrong understanding. More interesting and sensible would be going after combat strength on both sides but that would show results which would not fit your world view including going against "surrender party" myth. Edited July 24 by Pavel Novak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazyinsane105 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 1 hour ago, Stefan Kotsch said: This makes me thoughtful. Why don't we see this tremendous power on the battlefield? The statement contradicts everything we have seen so far. Well, battlefront is how long? It extends hundreds of miles from East to much of southern Ukraine. It really dilutes overall firepower that can be applied. Not to mention that larger gatherings of troops and equipment one location will attract some sort of artillery or HIMARS or ATACM strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alejandro_ Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 The active battlefront is 900 km, entire length 3,700km. It is also mentioned in the interview. As others have pointed out concentration of troops is difficult due to artillery/UAV attacks. TOS-1 in Avdiivka. Note Stupor antiUAV gun and 12 gauge? shotgun? https://riamediabank.ru/media/8730482.html?context=list&list_sid=list_342029200 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bojan Posted July 24 Author Share Posted July 24 (edited) And now full exotic blast from the past... RPG-6 anti-tank grenades, overhauled in Yugoslavia (Maintenance factory Kragujevac) in 1960 in Ukraine. РПТБ, (РПГ-6) (с) - RPTB (hand anti-tank grenade) (RPG-6) (Soviet) РЗК6001, Р - RZK (Maintenance factory Kragujevac), 6001 - 1960. year of overhaul, 1st batch, R = Remontovano (repaired/overhauled) Heavens know where those were found since I don't have a single picture or account of use in 1990s. Edited July 24 by bojan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 They have been using similar grenades, modified with 3d printed fins, as bomblets to be dropped by drones for at least a year. The bombs didnt look in quite good as condition as these though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazyinsane105 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 38 minutes ago, alejandro_ said: The active battlefront is 900 km, entire length 3,700km. It is also mentioned in the interview. As others have pointed out concentration of troops is difficult due to artillery/UAV attacks. TOS-1 in Avdiivka. Note Stupor antiUAV gun and 12 gauge? shotgun? https://riamediabank.ru/media/8730482.html?context=list&list_sid=list_342029200 12 gauge happens to be the most useful sidearm when combating drones. Who knew that birdshot would end up making itself on a modern day battlefield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Kotsch Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 59 minutes ago, crazyinsane105 said: 2 hours ago, Stefan Kotsch said: This makes me thoughtful. Why don't we see this tremendous power on the battlefield? The statement contradicts everything we have seen so far. Well, battlefront is how long? But it seems to me that the Russian losses are not included. Together with the losses, however, a number arises that does not become more realistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Alymov Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 1 hour ago, Pavel Novak said: I am not saying that original russian invasion strength was fine. It wasn't and it would work only if there was no organized resistance from ukr army. What I am saying is that if you say that ukr army has 1.3M people in army you need to understand that this is uncluding clercks, kitchen personel etc. Thus comparing this number only to russian troops deployed in Ukraine gives wrong understanding. More interesting and sensible would be going after combat strength on both sides but that would show results which would not fit your world view including going against "surrender party" myth. Why do you think Russian troops numbers do not include clercks, kitchen personel etc.? Kitchen personnel is where the units are, as well as clerks, drivers, people in repair workshops, signals, medics etc. It is not some sort of SOF operation abroad where only combat personnel go. Even units military orchestras are now in warzoner -for example, his guy from Bashkiria (who is, by the way, veteran of Syria campaign where he served as truck driver before becoming musician ) Боец из Башкирии служит в зоне СВО солистом военного оркестра (iglvesti.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ink Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 13 minutes ago, crazyinsane105 said: 12 gauge happens to be the most useful sidearm when combating drones. Who knew that birdshot would end up making itself on a modern day battlefield True indeed! But then who knew DJI drones would be so deadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 13 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said: Why do you think Russian troops numbers do not include clercks, kitchen personel etc.? Kitchen personnel is where the units are, as well as clerks, drivers, people in repair workshops, signals, medics etc. It is not some sort of SOF operation abroad where only combat personnel go. Even units military orchestras are now in warzoner -for example, his guy from Bashkiria (who is, by the way, veteran of Syria campaign where he served as truck driver before becoming musician ) Боец из Башкирии служит в зоне СВО солистом военного оркестра (iglvesti.com) Thats great, now you can have someone to play a tune for the historic march through Kyiv at the end of the war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alejandro_ Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 6 minutes ago, Stuart Galbraith said: Thats great, now you can have someone to play a tune for the historic march through Kyiv at the end of the war. How does this message add anything to the discussion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 (edited) Because I wrote it? Rather self evident I thought... Ukraine has gone back to using Car bombs. They also launched an air attack that damaged Russia's last railway ferry to Crimea. https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/ukraine-russia-latest-kyiv-destroys-putin-s-last-crimea-railway-ferry-as-new-russian-base-appears-near-front/ar-BB1pZjeB?ocid=BingNewsVerp Edited July 24 by Stuart Galbraith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Alymov Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 5 minutes ago, alejandro_ said: How does this message add anything to the discussion? It is very useful message: it indicates the Member is out of reasonable arguments to produce, so it is effectively the sign of concur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 Roman, we can discuss this at length on another thread if you prefer. But believe me, I have absolutely no limits to the reasonable arguments I can produce. The only question is whether, just like before 2022, anyone is going to bother to listen. As you were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markus Becker Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 5 hours ago, Stefan Kotsch said: This makes me thoughtful. Why don't we see this tremendous power on the battlefield? The statement contradicts everything we have seen so far. More AFV are just more targets IF the defence is sufficiently armed but that many more artillery systems should be noticed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazyinsane105 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 35 minutes ago, Markus Becker said: More AFV are just more targets IF the defence is sufficiently armed but that many more artillery systems should be noticed. Issue could also be attrition. Number of artillery units at the front can always be getting hit, and they need to pull more units from the rear to replace them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RETAC21 Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 6 hours ago, Stefan Kotsch said: This makes me thoughtful. Why don't we see this tremendous power on the battlefield? The statement contradicts everything we have seen so far. Russians have amassed substantial reserves behind the lines to avoid a second Kharkov offensive and to build up forces for a final offensive. In the meantime, they are happy to throw away mobiks and T-55/62s to conquer little villages and consume Ukrainian resources at an unequal exchange ratio: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alejandro_ Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 Yugo M72B1 RPK in 7.62x39mm caliber. Probably from Slovenia or Croatia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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