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Luftwaffe Hornets?


Dawes

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The Americans arent, if it doesnt help their defence industry. The French might, except it would mean enfranchising the NATO they want to do away with. We might, except we seem to be getting out of the designing nuclear weapons business and just making do with Yankee designs. Sooo....

 

Perhaps we can get the Russians or Chinese to design it? Business is business right? :)

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The Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear weapons forbids Germany from developing their own nukes or getting control over nukes from other countries. Even the current nuclear sharing with the US is questionable in that regard, but predates the NPT.

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  • 1 year later...

Interestingly new defense minister Christine Lambrecht is reported to have ordered another evaluation whether the F-35 could fill the nuclear participation and Eurofighter the ECM role. Though that could also be read as kicking the nuclear can further down the road.

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No argument, and in the end it may in fact speed up things since unlike the Superbug, the F-35 is already certified to carry the latest B61 variant. OTOH, more evaluation is a tried and true approach to delay an unwanted decision until it hopefully lands in the next government's lap.

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1 hour ago, BansheeOne said:

more evaluation is a tried and true approach to delay an unwanted decision until it hopefully lands in the next government's lap.

Absolutely.

"Death by trial".

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Defence Analysis (Francis Tusa) was quite scathing about the prospects of Super Hornets anywhere given how little the US Navy seems to like them nowadays. (This was in the context of the Canadians giving Boeing the big "fuck you" as Bombardier punishment, but seems fair enough.)

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On 1/8/2022 at 7:07 AM, BansheeOne said:

Interestingly new defense minister Christine Lambrecht is reported to have ordered another evaluation whether the F-35 could fill the nuclear participation and Eurofighter the ECM role. Though that could also be read as kicking the nuclear can further down the road.

Why wouldn't the F-35 be capable of filling the ECM role? My understanding is that this wasn't an escort or broadband capability but more of a SEAD/DEAD role, which the F-35 is well equipped to do.

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On 4/20/2020 at 3:38 AM, Simon Tan said:

F-15X. At least they can get to St Petersburg unrefuelled with a B61.

wait that's a nuke  ...your not actually suggesting....

 

.ohhh the horror ?

 

 

I've clearly been away tooo long

Edited by P Lakowski
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  • 2 months later...

Well the decision seems officially reverted to buying 35 F-35 for the nuclear delivery role and 15 ECR Eurofighters, though the latter are still vaporware at this point. Thank God, I have to say; I could have lived with the Super Hornet, but it would have been a second-best insular solution.

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It hasn't been stated explicitely, but I assume the current decision for the above mix instead of the previously planned 30 Strike Super Hornets and 15 Growlers doesn't affect the 40-55 additional Eurofighters intended to replace the rest of the Tornado fleet in the general fighter-bomber role.

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22 hours ago, lucklucky said:

So there will be a ECR EF, makes sense. Would Italians be in it like for the Tornado ECR?

I feel like it would make more sense to just use the F-35 in that role and buy some extras; it is an out of the box SEAD/ECR aircraft anyway.

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The capability notified for the 2031 NATO defense planning framework isn't SEAD rather than stand-off/escort jamming. Though I suspect that the decision is partly political just like the previous one, i. e. throwing domestic industry (particularly Airbus and Hensoldt) a bone.

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7 minutes ago, BansheeOne said:

The capability notified for the 2031 NATO defense planning framework isn't SEAD rather than stand-off/escort jamming. Though I suspect that the decision is partly political just like the previous one, i. e. throwing domestic industry (particularly Airbus and Hensoldt) a bone.

Which makes sense. For once you do not need Stealth for the mission and keeping those system houses in business and working is essential for FCAS. The knowledge gained will surely be useful for FCAS.

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1 hour ago, Josh said:

I feel like it would make more sense to just use the F-35 in that role and buy some extras; it is an out of the box SEAD/ECR aircraft anyway.

Not sure, Tornado ECR have a very sophisticated ESM system, they even took the guns out.

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I can't imagine it is more sophisticated than F-35 given the pace of technology. F-35 has wide band coverage in 360 degrees and can triangulate among its fellow aircraft with a directional data link in effectively real time.

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1 hour ago, Dawes said:

I've seen "ECR" interpreted as "Electronic Combat Role" and "Electronic Combat/ Reconaissance".  Is one more righter than the other?

Electronic Combat/ Reconaissance 

For SEAD (with Harm missiles) and reconaissance, i beleive the initial version had an night IR recon system in the fuselage.

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