Four Way Stops Vs. Roundabouts

[Mobius]

On the surface they seem safer than the stop sign intersection as there are no left hand turning vehicles to T-bone (right hand in the UK and Aus.). On the other-hand I was watching Australian and UK dash cam videos and there are a lot of accidents on these. Though the cars generally collide at obtuse angles so less KE and fatalities. Drivers that have accidents seem to not notice other circulating vehicles. Maybe distracted,

One article says there are 12% more single vehicle accidents on roundabouts than intersections. As drivers can't always negotiate the rather sharp turn.

Edited January 24, 2020 by Mobius

[Skywalkre]

Had these everywhere in CO when I was at Carson. Hated them. Folks don't heed when they should. I can't help but wonder if these exist solely to lower death counts but everything else (travel time, accident payouts, etc.) are higher.

 

They've started to pop up around where I live in the Valley and just reinforces that whatever passes for Transit authority here has lost their bloody mind.

[Jeff]

We've started using them as well, don't call them rotaries! They are survival of the fittest by automobile. You have to be both aggresive and defensive at the same time because the other guy will not do what you think he should.

[Wobbly Head]

I have driven in both Europe and US/Canada and roundabouts are vastly superior system as long as everyone knows and is taught how to use properly.

The problem is the proper use is not taught to new drivers in the US or Canada in the UK an Europe it is one of the first things taught and is part of the drivers test. The drivers tests in UK and Germany are actually hard and there is no shame in failure in Canada there is a bit of shame as you really need to screw up to fail the test there.

[DKTanker]

I have driven in both Europe and US/Canada and roundabouts are vastly superior system as long as everyone knows and is taught how to use properly.

The problem is the proper use is not taught to new drivers in the US or Canada in the UK an Europe it is one of the first things taught and is part of the drivers test. The drivers tests in UK and Germany are actually hard and there is no shame in failure in Canada there is a bit of shame as you really need to screw up to fail the test there.

I don't care how much training, you're still requiring drivers to continually merge across traffic. If you're just making a right hand turn it's all good, you just drive into the circle and immediately drive out at the next opportunity. However, if you need to make a LH turn you need to drive 270 degrees around the circle first merging to the inner part of the circle to allow other vehicles into the circle and then merging back to the outer lane to affect your exist from the circle. I avoid them like the plague, give me a 4-way stop or traffic light any day before a traffic circle.

[Daan]

Modern roundabout design limits the free-for-all aspect of some older designs (say around the Arc de Triomphe in Paris). This one is in the Netherlands; With the help of some traffic lights you get into the right lane quickly and the flow of traffic is quite good. I really prefer roundabouts to old fashioned intersections.

Edited January 24, 2020 by Daan

[Yama]

Roundabouts are great for light-medium traffic intersections. They somewhat stop working when traffic is heavy.

It is true you get more accidents in roundabout, but also way less fatal accidents. Typical accident in traffic lights is some idiot/drunk/druggie ignoring the red light and colliding at high speed at car coming through green lights at relatively high speed, because, hey, you have green light, step on it! Even at their worst, roundabout accidents are usually much lower energy collisions.

Also, roundabout always works, doesn't care if the power is off or light broken etc.

[Mikel2]

I have driven in both Europe and US/Canada and roundabouts are vastly superior system as long as everyone knows and is taught how to use properly.

 

Yup. Much more efficient at moving traffic than 4-way stops. Besides the unfamiliarity of the American public with how to use them, the problem is that when one leg has heavy traffic, the whole intersection suffers.

[GregShaw]

Pretty common here in Utah, especially in new construction. As Yama pointed out, they do handle light traffic loads well, and they are cheaper and less failure prone than lights. I haven't ever seen any accidents, but they are almost exclusively single lane and shallow entries. I have seen many more accidents at 4 ways, I was almost t-boned at one the other day by a lady who didn't seem to have any idea what the rules for 4-ways are.

[DougRichards]

We have a few local small roundabouts and they usually work well, so long as drivers remember the rule that the car on the roundabout first has right of way. Still many people here continue to think that those to the left of them have to give way (remember that in Australia we, like the Brits drive on the left).

 

Mind you I had the experience of a large black Porsche Cayanne 4wd (obviously a penis substitute) tailgate me to a roundabout and then overtake on the wrong side of that round about. Then we both had to stop at a set of lights just 400m later. And yes, I was driving at the correct speed limit for the street.

[MiloMorai]

Ran into the back of an Audi at a roundabout. Dumb bitched stopped at a Yeild sign because there was a car on the other side of the roundabout.

[Mobius]

[Adam_S]

Behold the Magic Roundabout!

 

 

 

 

Also:

https://www.roundaboutsofbritain.com/about-us/

Edited January 25, 2020 by Adam_S

[Corinthian]

Either doesn't matter if the vast majority of drivers on the road are idiots.

[Mobius]

What do the wavy lines mean?

[Ivanhoe]

Either doesn't matter if the vast majority of drivers on the road are idiots.

 

Yeah, bad idea here in the States. Strangely there is a rather tight single-lane roundabout (or as we say in 'Murrican, traffic circle) that feeds a nearby Walmart. Might be there to prevent semis from going that way. Haven't seen an accident yet, but I'm sure they are happening.

[DougRichards]

Ran into the back of an Audi at a roundabout. Dumb bitched stopped at a Yeild sign because there was a car on the other side of the roundabout.

Sorry, but if you rear ended her you were too close to stop if required. What if a kid had run in front of her and she needed to brake suddenly? It is up to the following driver to maintain a safe distance to stop.

[BansheeOne]

At the roundabout, take the second exit.

 

(Every European I&I).

[Stuart Galbraith]

Behold the Magic Roundabout!

 

 

 

 

Also:

https://www.roundaboutsofbritain.com/about-us/

 

That makes me so proud its so well known.

 

My father, who was a most careful driver, never went near it. It fulfills its role probably by driving traffic to go somewhere else, which is not a bad reason to have one if you live there I guess.

[Stuart Galbraith]

What do the wavy lines mean?

The magic round about? It means 'sacrifice goat here', the arrows mean 'sacrifice cockerall here'. To the God of traffic, so you get through without too much damage.

 

The boring answer means you cannot park there because there is a crossing. Obviously you can stop if there are lights at red, because, well lets just say not stopping at a crossing generally gives bad results. Or so Ive found anyway....

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/using-the-road-159-to-203

[Panzermann]

Modern roundabout design limits the free-for-all aspect of some older designs (say around the Arc de Triomphe in Paris). This one is in the Netherlands; With the help of some traffic lights you get into the right lane quickly and the flow of traffic is quite good. I really prefer roundabouts to old fashioned intersections.

 

The roundabout you linked I would rather describe as a circle shaped intersection with traffic lights. But wiht todays often high traffic a two or more lane roundabout (arc de trioumphe) is not really feasible anymore I think. so putting some traffic lights on them is a solution I think. And with the traffic lights disabled, they still work so so compared to confused drivers at a normal intersection with broken traffic lights.

[Harold Jones]

At the roundabout, take the second exit.

 

(Every European I&I).

I think it was especially bad in France, it seemed like there was a roundabout every 1.5 km or so.

Edited January 25, 2020 by Harold Jones

[Mobius]

 

Modern roundabout design limits the free-for-all aspect of some older designs (say around the Arc de Triomphe in Paris). This one is in the Netherlands; With the help of some traffic lights you get into the right lane quickly and the flow of traffic is quite good. I really prefer roundabouts to old fashioned intersections.

 

The roundabout you linked I would rather describe as a circle shaped intersection with traffic lights. But wiht todays often high traffic a two or more lane roundabout (arc de trioumphe) is not really feasible anymore I think. so putting some traffic lights on them is a solution I think.

A two lane roundabout would require the driver to change lanes twice in the circular drive. Once to go to the inner lane and once to go out to the outer lane. This is contrary to US driving practice which say don't change lanes in intersections.

[Yama]

Behold the Magic Roundabout!

 

What the hell is that? Some sort of symbol of the Space Nazis?

[DB]

On the surface they seem safer than the stop sign intersection as there are no left hand turning vehicles to T-bone (right hand in the UK and Aus.). On the other-hand I was watching Australian and UK dash cam videos and there are a lot of accidents on these. Though the cars generally collide at obtuse angles so less KE and fatalities. Drivers that have accidents seem to not notice other circulating vehicles. Maybe distracted,

One article says there are 12% more single vehicle accidents on roundabouts than intersections. As drivers can't always negotiate the rather sharp turn.

If you look at accident videos from countries that favour roundabouts over 4-way crossings, then you'll inevitably see a lot of accidents involving those junctions.

 

Classic roundabouts work best when traffic in all directions is evenly balanced. When one route is dominant, then it can be difficult to get out onto it if you're on the minor route. Which is why we have some roundabouts where traffic lights operate as well, sometimes only during peak periods.

 

There is a mythbusters episode where they demonstrate that a roundabout offers better throughput than a 4-way stop, using the same drivers but with a little training to know they have to give way to traffic on the roundabout.

 

It seems that the problems Americans are facing with roundabouts are primarily due to lack of exposure. As they become more prevalent, then people will get better at them.