Stuart Galbraith Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 17 minutes ago, DB said: Another example, perhaps, of mental illness not being solved by transitioning. As for a definition of mass shootings, nobody is going to agree what should or should not be counted for political reasons. It's not just the number of killed or wounded, it's the reason. Psychotic random killings, "going postal", killing the spouse and kids. Are these all the same? Probably not. One type is asocial, killing anyone in society at random. Someone who sits down with his wife and kids at the table and blows their brains out and then their own is killing for very different, social reasons. They might even pretend its a mercy killing. Although to think about it further, the motivations for walking in a school and shooting everyone on sight, or walking in a supermarket or Cinema and shooting everyone in sight is also different. Course it helps the media to lump it all together as if its the same problem, and I suppose as far as methodology there isnt much to choose between them.
Ivanhoe Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 38 minutes ago, Stuart Galbraith said: Course it helps the media to lump it all together as if its the same problem, and I suppose as far as methodology there isnt much to choose between them. Of course. The press uses hoodrat stuff to vastly pump up the numbers so that John and Jane Q. Surburbia think that they are at great risk from a mass shooter, and more amenable to more government/less citizenship. Heck, don't be surprised when the pro-pedotrans crowd uses the Nashville tragedy to pump up the "violence against trans" narrative. Who's gonna check to see whether the ballyhooed numbers are for trans victims vice perpetrators?
Mighty_Zuk Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 2 hours ago, Rick said: "Mass shooting" in the U.S. means an attempt to repeal the 2 Amendment. Missing the obvious is the fact that in an era of stricter gun laws, "mass shootings" are more common. How are these kids even getting guns in the first place? And what does a mass shooter get? Just prison time?
Rick Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 3 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said: How are these kids even getting guns in the first place? And what does a mass shooter get? Just prison time? First question -- I don't know. Second question is -- sometimes death, sometimes prison.
rmgill Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said: How are these kids even getting guns in the first place? Same way they get drugs. There's a black market, or they steal them. There's a great deal of very poor child rearing going on in this country. I heard the is one fellow lamenting that his teenage daughter's school is not teaching her how to wash dishes (scrub food off the plates before loading) when he and her are doing chores. I was wondering how/why he couldn't teach his daughter at elementary school age the proper chore methods rather than waiting on the school to do it in home ec (Home Economics, is a class in US schools, usually taught to girls who's moms can't teach em the fundamentals) . Of course, then I was talking to a friend yesterday who just finished an advanced CQB course where one of the instructors who's quite experienced talked about being out shot at a match of some sort by a 12 year old amish girl. So clearly some parents are teaching kids some competence. 24 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said: And what does a mass shooter get? Just prison time? Most mass shooters end up dead. It's a blaze of glory thing. If captured expect to see life in prison without parole. Edited March 28, 2023 by rmgill
DKTanker Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 3 hours ago, Rick said: "Mass shooting" in the U.S. means an attempt to repeal the 2 Amendment. Missing the obvious is the fact that in an era of stricter gun laws, "mass shootings" are more common. This is exactly so. Two weeks ago a women killed three children and severely wounded two others. It didn't make national news because....she used a knife to carve up the children.
rmgill Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 I am sure that a number of qualified experts might quibble over nuances and technique of room clearing. But Nashville Metro PD piled on like they should. Stacks of 3 that then make entry and search for the shooter is very on point after many of the lessons learned. Contrast this to Uvalde PD who stood around holding their dicks while victims lay bleeding out and the shooter was able to do what he wished.
Angrybk Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 (edited) 2 minutes ago, rmgill said: I am sure that a number of qualified experts might quibble over nuances and technique of room clearing. But Nashville Metro PD piled on like they should. Stacks of 3 that then make entry and search for the shooter is very on point after many of the lessons learned. Contrast this to Uvalde PD who stood around holding their dicks while victims lay bleeding out and the shooter was able to do what he wished. I was pretty impressed by the school staffer at the beginning conveying useful info and not freaking out. Also the cops actually got keys for the doors! Edited March 28, 2023 by Angrybk
rmgill Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 Great point. I noticed that as well but set it aside mentally after noting the police clearing. Someone handing off useful info and KEYS was important.
Murph Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 Wow, another transvestite just murdered a bunch of normal kids, and now the media is shocked that she was "misgendered". Not that she murdered six innocent people, but that she was "misgendered".
DKTanker Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 26 minutes ago, Murph said: Wow, another transvestite just murdered a bunch of normal kids, and now the media is shocked that she was "misgendered". Not that she murdered six innocent people, but that she was "misgendered". One can only speculate what they'll make of her signing her suicide note to a friend, Audrey (Aiden).
Mighty_Zuk Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 2 hours ago, DKTanker said: This is exactly so. Two weeks ago a women killed three children and severely wounded two others. It didn't make national news because....she used a knife to carve up the children. I think the point they're making is not that guns cause people to kill, but rather that they enable them to kill more people. This is not something that should be disqualified from any logical, civilized debate. And no, I do not have an opinion on the 2nd amendment.
R011 Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 7 hours ago, DB said: Another example, perhaps, of mental illness not being solved by transitioning. As for a definition of mass shootings, nobody is going to agree what should or should not be counted for political reasons. It's not just the number of killed or wounded, it's the reason. Psychotic random killings, "going postal", killing the spouse and kids. Are these all the same? Usually it means one group of criminals settling scores with another group of criminals. Or bystanders, or people who look like the targets in the wrong place at the wrong time. That's pretty much the case for many or most non-"mass" murders too.
R011 Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 4 hours ago, Mighty_Zuk said: How are these kids even getting guns in the first place? And what does a mass shooter get? Just prison time? Most seem to get them from home. Penalties depend on the state with some treating them as adults and others as young offenders. I don't think the Supreme Court allows the death penalty for under 18s, but life without parole is an option in many states as well as life with a long period before parole eligibility.
Stargrunt6 Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 (edited) The weapons used. They called the Keltec pistol carbine "AR style." Dear Lord... https://www.yahoo.com/news/photos-revealed-nashville-shooter-guns-123659954.html Edited March 28, 2023 by Stargrunt6
DKTanker Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 7 hours ago, DB said: Another example, perhaps, of mental illness not being solved by transitioning. Oh, Prescient one, we are not worthy. It was just reported that Audrey Hale was indeed undergoing psychiatric care. Additionally, her "trans" life is a relatively new phenomenon and her parents, with whom she was living, were under the impression she owned no firearms.
Mighty_Zuk Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 21 minutes ago, R011 said: Most seem to get them from home. Penalties depend on the state with some treating them as adults and others as young offenders. I don't think the Supreme Court allows the death penalty for under 18s, but life without parole is an option in many states as well as life with a long period before parole eligibility. If they get them from home, what penalty do the parents typically incur?
DB Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 27 minutes ago, DKTanker said: Oh, Prescient one, we are not worthy. It was just reported that Audrey Hale was indeed undergoing psychiatric care. Additionally, her "trans" life is a relatively new phenomenon and her parents, with whom she was living, were under the impression she owned no firearms. Prescience is not required, is it? Nor is sarcasm, if that was your aim. I'm not excusing this person, by the way. A reason for dysfunction is not the same as an excuse, or an absolution. My comment was more aimed at the current fashion to push people towards a transgender diagnosis rather than actually finding out they're more interested in murdering people.
Skywalkre Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 45 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said: If they get them from home, what penalty do the parents typically incur? At the extreme the parents can be charged such as the case still pending with the parents of a shooter in MI.
Skywalkre Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 With what's coming out (though authorities still haven't released anything from the manifesto) it looks like another case where mental health is the underlying issue. The shooter was suicidal beforehand. She messaged an acquaintance just before the shooting that she was about to do it, said acquaintance did everything right in trying to alert the authorities, and sounds like they should have responded more promptly to this but since it was so close to when the shooting started it might not have mattered. So... going to lead to a lot of questions about how many signs were showing beforehand and for how long? Who saw them and what did they do? If they did the right thing was the lack of mental health support an issue? If they didn't act on them... why?
rmgill Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 1 hour ago, Stargrunt6 said: The weapons used. They called the Keltec pistol carbine "AR style." Dear Lord... We call them EBRs. Evil Black Rifles.
sunday Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 36 minutes ago, DB said: My comment was more aimed at the current fashion to push people towards a transgender diagnosis rather than actually finding out they're more interested in murdering people. Give the man a cigar. Lots of Asperger's and the like get transitioned.
rmgill Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 1 hour ago, Mighty_Zuk said: If they get them from home, what penalty do the parents typically incur? Depends. In rural america its not unreasonable for kids to have access to firearms. Even rifles. Many kids hunt from a pretty early age. Even if locked up, kids have plenty of time to attempt to circumvent many security measures. They do live there.
rmgill Posted March 28, 2023 Posted March 28, 2023 36 minutes ago, sunday said: Give the man a cigar. Lots of Asperger's and the like get transitioned. A co-worker who's definitely on the scale had two kids who have transitioned. All kinds of absurd there.
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