Stuart Galbraith Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 They would make sure they have the numbers of the bank accounts first. Just in case.
Josh Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 (edited) What role would Wagner be playing?Isn't that pretty obvious? To provide personal guards for Maduro. Just a thought - in case Maduro's army is compromised, and start losing support for him because he will run out of money eventually, Wagner will be his way out of the country. This was explicitly what the original report mentioned - security detail. When ten percent of the population has become a refugee in a foreign country, it must be hard to find loyal guards who's families aren't affected by your shitty policies. I'd want Russian mercs myself. I imagine it is a small force who's primary goal is to prevent inside jobs, not hold off a coup. Edited January 30, 2019 by Josh
rmgill Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 (edited) They're just practicing for the inevitable hasty exit from the country. Edited January 30, 2019 by rmgill
Roman Alymov Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 What role would Wagner be playing?Isn't that pretty obvious? To provide personal guards for Maduro. Just a thought - in case Maduro's army is compromised, and start losing support for him because he will run out of money eventually, Wagner will be his way out of the country. "Wagner" (mysterious Russian mercenaries so much talked about, but never seen) can't be way out of the country as first and foremost mission of any personal guards is situation awareness, correct reaction to events and ability to negotiate way out of complicated situation. Russian-speaking mercinaries, even with basic Spanish, could not do this job - but are potential problem themselves as they easily could shoot wrong person they consider aggressive attacker (and who is in fact just Maduro enthusiastic fan). I have seen lots of this problems when working with ESPN Mexico this summer - crowds of Mexican fans were literally jumping on Mexican TV hosts and only Mexicans themselves were able to tell who is problem and who is just enthusiast with some overdose of beer. Cubans are best choice here - native Spanish speakers, well trained, educated, ideologically motivated, dedicated.
glenn239 Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 This whole crisis seems like a bit of a nothingburger so far. Maybe its about to heat up, but for a revolution or coup, it's awfully polite at the moment.
Mighty_Zuk Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 With gold now being transferred to Russia, I guess it won't take long until Maduro receives refugee status in Russia, a mansion, and about 10% of the gold's worth in exchange for Russia keeping everything else.
Stargrunt6 Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 Not to worry Roman, I remember. And never fear, im sure they will have the opportunity to do it again shortly.The problem is complete story was fake, despite of even Russian MOI badge demonstrated from Maidan stage (and all Ukrainian TV channels)https://www.obozrevatel.com/crime/75168-na-majdane-s-ofitsera-vo-vremya-shturma-sorvali-shevron-s-dvuglavyim-orlom.htm But who could blame them for this small trickMaybe that incident was a fake, and I don't know enough to say that it is. However, it would be absurd to think that the Kremlin would not be interested enough in the Venezuela to send personnel. They sold them t-90s and almost got them a nuclear reactor. Not very far removed from Putin's foreign policy in Syria and other Middle East allies. Of all the customers in the Americas, Venezuela seems to be Moscow's biggest: https://www.americasquarterly.org/content/russo-latin-american-arms-sales
Stuart Galbraith Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 With gold now being transferred to Russia, I guess it won't take long until Maduro receives refugee status in Russia, a mansion, and about 10% of the gold's worth in exchange for Russia keeping everything else. And a Gnu collection. Gnu's are very important in some quarters.
Stargrunt6 Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 What role would Wagner be playing?Isn't that pretty obvious? To provide personal guards for Maduro. Just a thought - in case Maduro's army is compromised, and start losing support for him because he will run out of money eventually, Wagner will be his way out of the country. "Wagner" (mysterious Russian mercenaries so much talked about, but never seen) can't be way out of the country as first and foremost mission of any personal guards is situation awareness, correct reaction to events and ability to negotiate way out of complicated situation. Russian-speaking mercinaries, even with basic Spanish, could not do this job - but are potential problem themselves as they easily could shoot wrong person they consider aggressive attacker (and who is in fact just Maduro enthusiastic fan). I have seen lots of this problems when working with ESPN Mexico this summer - crowds of Mexican fans were literally jumping on Mexican TV hosts and only Mexicans themselves were able to tell who is problem and who is just enthusiast with some overdose of beer. Cubans are best choice here - native Spanish speakers, well trained, educated, ideologically motivated, dedicated.Although involved, Cuba is a little on the broke side to be that decisive. And Spanish isn't that hard to learn, it wouldn't be the Kremlin's first road show in the Americas.
Josh Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 I have a hard time believing that Wagner doesn't have access to a platoon or so of Spanish speakers. They seem to have hundreds if not thousands of contractors.
Roman Alymov Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 (edited) Weekly summary from our local TV (with Eng subtitles) Edited January 30, 2019 by Roman Alymov
Mighty_Zuk Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 (edited) Weekly summary from our local TV (with Eng subtitles) TIL The Venezuelan Parliament are Americans... Maduro, by Venezuelan law, is not even a president because he didn't swear in as a president. He was an absentee in his inauguration, and yet this absolute buffoon Dmitry Kiselyov, whose rants I (unfortunately) have to listen to on a daily basis, along with his bed pal Solovyov, calls him "lEgiTimAtE" Edited January 30, 2019 by Mighty_Zuk
Simon Tan Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 Wagner are voenspets. Specialists with skills to augment the capabilities of Russian and allied forces (e.g. 5th Assault Corps) using non-service members. The PSD guarding Soheil 'Tiger' Hassan are not Wagner but Russian military.
Colin Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 Well the good news is that any Russians going to Venezuela are going to come back with "What a fucked up country and the women are hot" No amount of propaganda is going to put lipstick on that pig.
Ivanhoe Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 https://finance.yahoo.com/news/venezuela-20-tons-gold-ready-004013962.html (Bloomberg) -- Venezuelan lawmaker Jose Guerra dropped a bombshell on Twitter Tuesday: The Russian Boeing 777 that had landed in Caracas the day before was there to spirit away 20 tons of gold from the vaults of the country’s central bank. The claim set off a welter of social media speculation and outrage. When asked how he knew this, Guerra provided no evidence. Just another outlandish comment from a lawmaker trying to draw attention to the plight of crisis-torn Venezuela? Perhaps not. For one thing, Guerra is a former central bank economist who remains in touch with old colleagues there. For another, a person with direct knowledge of the matter told Bloomberg News Tuesday that 20 tons of gold have been set aside in the central bank for loading. Worth some $840 million, the gold represents about 20 percent of its holdings of the metal in Venezuela, the person said. He provided no further information on plans for those bars.
JasonJ Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 Well the good news is that any Russians going to Venezuela are going to come back with "What a fucked up country and the women are hot" No amount of propaganda is going to put lipstick on that pig. If Maduro slips past this, his international buddies will put lipstick on him. http://www.tank-net.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=39564&page=115&do=findComment&comment=1383196
Roman Alymov Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 TIL The Venezuelan Parliament are Americans... Maduro, by Venezuelan law, is not even a president because he didn't swear in as a president. He was an absentee in his inauguration, aCould you please remind me what sanctions were applied on Boris Yeltsin for shooting Russian Parliament by tank cannons?19931996
Roman Alymov Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 and yet this absolute buffoon Dmitry Kiselyov, whose rants I (unfortunately) have to listen to on a daily basis, along with his bed pal Solovyov, calls him "lEgiTimAtE" If you do not like Russian TV shows, what make you watching them? Is it your job? By the way Kiselev is, as far as i remember, weekly news host, so i doubt you could listen to him daily....
Roman Alymov Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 I have a hard time believing that Wagner doesn't have access to a platoon or so of Spanish speakers. They seem to have hundreds if not thousands of contractors.No doubt it is possible to hire platoon-size force of Spanish speakers in Russia; but they will be useless as personal guards as it takes years of training as team to be effective. There is no magic in "Russian guards" - if they are untrained as this, they will be not more effective then local ones.
Stuart Galbraith Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-47066906 Venezuela's opposition leader Juan Guaidó says he has held secret meetings with the military to win support for ousting President Nicolás Maduro.Mr Guaidó declared himself interim president earlier this month and was immediately recognised by the US and several Latin American countries.Major powers Russia and China back Mr Maduro and military support is seen as crucial to his hold on power.The crisis comes as Mr Maduro began a second term after controversial polls.Many opposition candidates were barred from running or jailed. Doesnt sound very secret though, does it?
Roman Alymov Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 Doesnt sound very secret though, does it? As for me it is indication of him failing to gain real support of military up to now (or even not having this meetings at all)
Stuart Galbraith Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 Im sure Salvador Allende consoled himself with similar thinking. Right up to being on the receiving end of a Hawker Hunter.
sunday Posted January 31, 2019 Author Posted January 31, 2019 Im sure Salvador Allende consoled himself with similar thinking. Right up to being on the receiving end of a Hawker Hunter. He suicided. Some years too late, however.
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