Jump to content

Repulse/prince Of Wales Sinking


Brian Kennedy

Recommended Posts

 

My bad :)

No problem; Doug is off, too. In '38, it was the Army Air CORPS. :P Zoomies were just getting their wings (and attitude ;) )

 

 

I accept the rebuke willingly and with a toxic masculine grin on my face. :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 129
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

 

 

 

 

My bad :)

No problem; Doug is off, too. In '38, it was the Army Air CORPS. :P Zoomies were just getting their wings (and attitude ;) )

I accept the rebuke willingly and with a toxic masculine grin on my face. :D
HA! 😝 Edited by shep854
Link to comment
Share on other sites

According to Wiki the record-breaker Wellesleys were 3 out of 5 special builds, which fact makes them comparable to the 2 Russian special aircraft, not? Everyday aviation seems to be far from 11.000 kilometers then.

 

That is true, but if the USA had understood that the ANTS that crossed the pole had not a snowflake's chance in hell of becoming a viable weapon against the USA, then the feat would have been meaningless. The Wellessley were at least based on a service aircraft, and demonstrated in many ways that other service aircraft, not just esoteric experimental types, were capable of adoption for long range.

 

It should be remembered that the next record holder (not closed circuit that is) - the P-2 known as the Truculent Turtle - was the third production Neptune and had been re-fitted "Loaded with fuel in extra tanks fitted in practically every spare space in the aircraft," which did not stop that particular aircraft from being able to claim the record, while service aircraft continued to be built. No service ANT-25 was ever constructed. It was a design dead end.

Edited by DougRichards
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

 

My bad :)

No problem; Doug is off, too. In '38, it was the Army Air CORPS. :P Zoomies were just getting their wings (and attitude ;) )

I accept the rebuke willingly and with a toxic masculine grin on my face. :D
HA!

 

 

But I will not shave that toxic masculine face with a Gillette razor, whilst the face on my wrist (word play - face - dial) will be by Egard. :P

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 years later...

Its about time the British Government grew a pair of balls and put a flea in the ear of the PRC ambassador. 

Happily the malayians have been pretty good about this. They already scuttled one barge that was carrying bit of these ships.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And its pure greed. If they want metal that was forged pre 1945, there is still plenty to be had in Scapa Flow.

Its not even the first time the PRC has done it. I remember reading of a Royal Navy submarine that sank near Hong Kong in 1931. Anyway, the PRC salvaged that too, sometime in the 1970's. The first anyone heard about it was when headstones started turning up in a Chinese Graveyard with English names on them. Which I suppose was better than these worthless bastards, which presumably are just discarding any human remains they find.

The PRC is really very good at pissing people off, at a time when they could do with making as many friends as they can get.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Try as I might, I cant conflate a warship which has been on the bottom 200 years, with one thats been on the bottom 70, and whom either crewmen, or near relations of those deceased are still alive.

Its an absurd comparison. One is archaeology, the other is pure graverobbing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

Its an absurd comparison. One is archaeology, the other is pure graverobbing.

One does not justify the other, and both are wrong. Calling archeology the looting of a warship to get 500 million $ in silver coins is simply ludicrous. Do you really think hat the company that grabbed the treasure was going to donate them to museums? They even try to hide the real name of the ship and it's position to avoid getting caught.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For me, is someone is recovering coins, and the record the location, and they are adding to the historical knowledge, then thats archaology. You might not like the people doing it, you might not even like their motivation. But that for me is precisely what it is.

And its still about 200 years beyond comparison, so Im not really sure why it was even flagged up.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Swan_Project

Quote

The Black Swan Project is the project name given by Odyssey Marine Exploration for its discovery and recovery of an estimated US$500 million (£314 million) worth of silver and gold coins from the ocean floor. Initially Odyssey kept the origin of the treasure confidential. It was later proved in trial that the recovered cargo was being carried by the Spanish frigate Nuestra Señora de las Mercedes, which was sunk by the British Royal Navy off Portugal in 1804.[1]

Quote

Knowledge of the recovery became public on May 18, 2007, when the company flew 17 tons[2] of coins, mostly silver, from Gibraltar to a secure location of unknown address in Florida, United States. The company did not release the type, date, or nationality of the coins, while a rumor attributed it to the Merchant Royal, which sank near Land's End in 1641.[3] At the time, Odyssey said that it planned to return to the site to perform an excavation expected to uncover more coins as well as other artifacts.[4] However, Odyssey was sued by the Spanish government in U.S. courts, which eventually ordered the treasure to be returned to Spain. Odyssey pursued all legal avenues, even taking the case to the U.S. Supreme Court and losing. On February 27, 2012, the ship's treasure was flown back to Spain where the coins and other artifacts from the shipwreck are now in the National Museum of Subaquatic Archaeology in Cartagena (Murcia).[5] In 2015 a U.S. district court ordered Odyssey to pay Spain $1 million for "bad faith and abusive litigation."[1]

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

For me, is someone is recovering coins, and the record the location, and they are adding to the historical knowledge, then thats archaology. You might not like the people doing it, you might not even like their motivation. But that for me is precisely what it is.

And its still about 200 years beyond comparison, so Im not really sure why it was even flagged up.

And destroying a war grave is salvage, since they are outside of UK territorial waters, more so as both cases are driven by greed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

53 minutes ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

I somehow doubt if a PRC firm was ripping apart the wreck of the Baleares, that it would be seen as anything more than grave robbery.

But as you will.

Well, we had a US firm ripping apart the wreck of the Mercedes and you call that archeology. It's both or neither, either all are graves or they aren't.

And not only the Chinese, BTW: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/18/battle-jutland-war-graves-hms-warrior-metal-scavengers-royal-navy

"Commercial metal salvage companies are believed to have been operating across the North Sea battlefield in recent years without being challenged by British authorities despite the wrecks being covered by the Protection of Military Remains Act 1986, which makes it illegal for Britons to disturb them, and under sovereign immunity that could allow overseas prosecutions."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, not that many years ago pics circulated of some British company salvaging Jutland wrecks, with all the ships, worker faces etc. visible and recognizable. I don't think it led to anything.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To be fair, pre-nuclear age steel and other metals are (or at least used to be) essential for some precision measuring equipment. 

And basically only way to acquire those metals is pre-nuclear detonation shipwrecks underwater. 

Edited by Sardaukar
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, Yama said:

Yes, not that many years ago pics circulated of some British company salvaging Jutland wrecks, with all the ships, worker faces etc. visible and recognizable. I don't think it led to anything.

Far more common for German companies to be doing it I think you will find. There was at least one British cruiser that seems to have been completely removed by German salvage companies.

Ultimately it doesnt matter who is doing it. I thought we would all agree that desecrating war graves is generally a bad thing, but as usual it degenerated into yet another Tanknet pissing contest.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Time ago, the expression "I stand corrected" was a distinguishing feature of posts in the Grate Sight, one feature that usually identified wise members.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, Sardaukar said:

To be fair, pre-nuclear age steel and other metals are (or at least used to be) essential for some precision measuring equipment. 

And basically only way to acquire those metals is pre-nuclear detonation shipwrecks underwater. 

There's plenty of pre-nuclear steel and iron around without desecrating war graves.

Salvage is usually to get non-ferrous or precious metals. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...