Free Speech In The Uk

[rmgill]

You're aware of the concept of self loathing right?

 

See also Sally Boynton Brown.

Edited August 7, 2018 by rmgill

[Panzermann]

 

 

I think its more to do with the fact that Robinson is, though many ignore it, just what Chris says. A lowlife white Fascist. It doesnt mean he is guilty, equally it doesn't mean he should be given special treatment because it suits some people to think he is a different person than he is.

Is there something organic about being white that would differentiate a white fascist from say a purple fascist, or is it your bigotry oozing through as well?

 

 

 

low-life? Well, working class hooligan is what I would describe Yaxley-Lennon/Robinson as. He certainly looks the part. A guy from the lower classes, that of course the burgoise self-proclaimed "gentle" men look down upon and sneeze at, because Tommy does not act like they do and is not from their class. TR gives a face to the working class (well maybe unemployed class nowadays) and the problems they face. Which among other things have been pockets of islamic parallel societies, that did as they pleased and were ignored by the fine middle classes, because of fear of being labeled racists, if they had actually started to follow the leads and tip-offs. It looks to me so far at least.

 

 

a fascist? How so? He loudly left the EDL when it shifted towards (neo)nazi ideology and racism. He certainly does not like islam, but I havent seen him wanting to implement a totalitarian state so far. Maybe I have missed it?

 

 

If Tommy Robinson is right with all his issues he brings forth is to be debated. Intruding in court trials is certainly the wrong thing to do of course and hurting his cause I think. Having him effectively locked in solitary, although he was not considered as dangerous or anything is to be investigated if it was correct by HM Prsion Services or not. So far the original trial has been sent back to square one for a long list of reasons. I guess TR is going to sue against the prison service and the court. But the mills of justice work slowly and this is going to take years clearing this up and getting at all the CYA gov clerks that were involved. And I doubt it will all be cleared satisfactorily in the end.

[Panzermann]

a book review from 2016 of his memoirs

 

What's it like to be Britain's most hated man? Ask Tommy Robinson

 

 

(...)Nevertheless, Tommy is convinced that from the moment he got involved with the EDL he was subjected to a non-stop campaign by the police to use every power they had to harass, disrupt, and, ultimately, recruit him. Prima facie it looks that way. He has been arrested and acquitted an incredible number of times; bail hearings were set at intentionally awkward times; bail conditions were sometimes highly dubious. He even claims that prison guards kept putting him on Muslim majority wings so he’d get beaten up. Perhaps most worrying of all is that, as I read it, most of this was probably all within the law – a series of quite clever, if very aggressive, policing tactics. It’s hard to make out whether or not there is a legal case to answer here, since the numerous claims he makes are difficult to investigate fully. A civil liberties specialist might look into it: but because it’s Tommy Robinson, I wouldn’t hold my breath.

 

 

And the reason I wouldn't hold my breath is because Tommy is a pariah. That’s really the background noise for the entire book, although Robinson doesn’t raise it explicitly: that life as a political activist on the fringes of polite opinion really is no fun at all. It’s clear that Tommy had a lot of good times with the EDL – it was often more like a lads’ weekend away than a political movement – but it also wrecked his personal life. On top of the state’s relentless squeeze, he was (and still is) often aggressed in the streets, beaten up, had several Osman warnings, moved house numerous times, was called a Nazi, thought his mum was going to lose her job, and on and on. Irrespective of whatever he says and does, he’s frequently labelled a racist or a fascist by media and the holders of polite opinion, which severely limits one's licence to operate. Step too far outside mainstream opinion and life as an activist gets very hard indeed – especially if you're not media-trained and you're working-class.

(...)

 

 

Although Tommy was winding them up, the aggression did all come from the anti-fascist protesters (that wasn't always the case with the EDL of course. Tommy even admitted that had this been the EDL, they would have probably charged the anti-fascist group). One demonstrator attacked our taxi; later that night, the hotel we were staying in had a police guard outside because some of them tried to follow him after the demonstration. A lot of people won’t lose any sleep over this I expect, but they should. How far people feel free – legally and socially – to voice controversial opinions is important even for those who detest Robinson’s politics. A society where people with views outside the mainstream have to go through all this is not a healthy one in the long term. In a strange sort of way, how we treat people we disagree with is an indication of how free society really is. I think we still have some work to do.(...)

 

Not that I want to paint him as a democratic hero fighting for your rights. Although he’s surprisingly honest about the bad things he’s done, you wonder throughout if certain things are either omitted or downplayed. The EDL caused a huge amount of aggravation for a lot of people, and too often the mob tipped into nasty and aggressive Islamophobia. Even though he raised that mob, Tommy never really takes any responsibility for this. Every time an EDL supporter did something bad, Tommy passes it off as just a rotten apple. That includes, at times, himself. Like the time he and 70 others piled into a lorry with some vague plan to turn up at Abu Hamza’s house or at the homes of three convicted paedophiles, with unclear aims. This looks like dangerous street justice, but it’s passed off as a mix of anger, frustration, adrenaline, booze and naivety. Yet when a Muslim does something bad it’s not a bad apple: it’s the entire religion and spineless political classes that are to blame.

 

(...)

 

 

Not strange at all. Especially how we treat opinions we disagree with is the yardstick of freedom. (see also Voltaire, Locke and those other philosopher guys)

Edited August 7, 2018 by Panzermann

[Briganza]

 

 

 

I think its more to do with the fact that Robinson is, though many ignore it, just what Chris says. A lowlife white Fascist. It doesnt mean he is guilty, equally it doesn't mean he should be given special treatment because it suits some people to think he is a different person than he is.

Is there something organic about being white that would differentiate a white fascist from say a purple fascist, or is it your bigotry oozing through as well?

 

 

 

low-life? Well, working class hooligan is what I would describe Yaxley-Lennon/Robinson as. He certainly looks the part. A guy from the lower classes, that of course the burgoise self-proclaimed "gentle" men look down upon and sneeze at, because Tommy does not act like they do and is not from their class. TR gives a face to the working class (well maybe unemployed class nowadays) and the problems they face. Which among other things have been pockets of islamic parallel societies, that did as they pleased and were ignored by the fine middle classes, because of fear of being labeled racists, if they had actually started to follow the leads and tip-offs. It looks to me so far at least.

 

 

a fascist? How so? He loudly left the EDL when it shifted towards (neo)nazi ideology and racism. He certainly does not like islam, but I havent seen him wanting to implement a totalitarian state so far. Maybe I have missed it?

 

 

If Tommy Robinson is right with all his issues he brings forth is to be debated. Intruding in court trials is certainly the wrong thing to do of course and hurting his cause I think. Having him effectively locked in solitary, although he was not considered as dangerous or anything is to be investigated if it was correct by HM Prsion Services or not. So far the original trial has been sent back to square one for a long list of reasons. I guess TR is going to sue against the prison service and the court. But the mills of justice work slowly and this is going to take years clearing this up and getting at all the CYA gov clerks that were involved. And I doubt it will all be cleared satisfactorily in the end.

 

Robinson has learnt something over the last couple of months and has now moved from the unemployed working class to the working class.

 

It became evident that putting items on the internet and telling people his speech had been restricted earned him money. All the ranting he made when he came out of prison was aimed at the US market.

 

His claims of his treatment in prison to a UK audience were ludicrous and quickly shown to be lies but the in the US it was lapped up. Shit thrown through the door of his cell was accepted by people who didn't know that in the UK cell doors are solid. When this was pointed out it turned to windows but as there is a massive drugs problem in UK prison and the use of drones to deliver them, access to the outside of cell is greatly restricted. Looking at Onley it is a two story building and unless Robinson had a cross of St George hung from his window it would have been difficult to locate (and you don't want to throw shit through the wrong window). Robinson's cell was opposite a mosque, and this was lapped up by the US audience. Only one problem, there is no mosque. It goes on and on.

 

As a result, these donations to Robinson to fight the good fight have been flooding in. He has been stopped from talking, on he hasn't, you can't shut him up.

[Stuart Galbraith]

Why does it matter what race they are?

 

Are white fascists worse somehow than say Asian Fascists?

 

 

If you are a White Facist, you can join the BNP. If you are an Asian Fascist, a Muslim Fascist or African Fascist, you cant. You Americans are trying to separate fascism from its Ethnic roots. Yes, in some places, it may be true. In the BNP, it isnt.

 

Robinson joined the BNP and left after a year after implausibly saying he didnt know non white people couldnt join. That kind of like joining the Nazi party and not expecting to bait jews.

[Stuart Galbraith]

 

 

 

I think its more to do with the fact that Robinson is, though many ignore it, just what Chris says. A lowlife white Fascist. It doesnt mean he is guilty, equally it doesn't mean he should be given special treatment because it suits some people to think he is a different person than he is.

Is there something organic about being white that would differentiate a white fascist from say a purple fascist, or is it your bigotry oozing through as well?

 

 

 

low-life? Well, working class hooligan is what I would describe Yaxley-Lennon/Robinson as. He certainly looks the part. A guy from the lower classes, that of course the burgoise self-proclaimed "gentle" men look down upon and sneeze at, because Tommy does not act like they do and is not from their class. TR gives a face to the working class (well maybe unemployed class nowadays) and the problems they face. Which among other things have been pockets of islamic parallel societies, that did as they pleased and were ignored by the fine middle classes, because of fear of being labeled racists, if they had actually started to follow the leads and tip-offs. It looks to me so far at least.

 

 

a fascist? How so? He loudly left the EDL when it shifted towards (neo)nazi ideology and racism. He certainly does not like islam, but I havent seen him wanting to implement a totalitarian state so far. Maybe I have missed it?

 

 

If Tommy Robinson is right with all his issues he brings forth is to be debated. Intruding in court trials is certainly the wrong thing to do of course and hurting his cause I think. Having him effectively locked in solitary, although he was not considered as dangerous or anything is to be investigated if it was correct by HM Prsion Services or not. So far the original trial has been sent back to square one for a long list of reasons. I guess TR is going to sue against the prison service and the court. But the mills of justice work slowly and this is going to take years clearing this up and getting at all the CYA gov clerks that were involved. And I doubt it will all be cleared satisfactorily in the end.

 

 

OK, so its wikilinks with all the attendent inaccuracies that apply. If anyone can refute any of these, Ill happily remove them (Heck, ill go and alter the wiki entry myself)

 

As pointed out, he was a BNP member. Somehow claiming these are not the inheritors of the proud Blackshirt Tradition is ignoring the facts.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tommy_Robinson_%28activist%29

Robinson joined the British National Party, then led by Nick Griffin, in 2004. When questioned about this by journalist Andrew Neil in June 2013, he said that he had left after one year, saying, "I didn't know Nick Griffin was in the National Front, I didn't know non-whites couldn't join the organisation. I joined, I saw what it was about, it was not for me".^[1]

 

^{Yes, after a year. You might well ask, what took him so long?}

 

^{And before anyone gets the idea the BNP is some kind of misguided sports organization,}

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_National_Party

It promotes biological racism and the white genocide conspiracy theory, calling for global racial separatism and condemning interracial relationships. Under Tyndall, the BNP emphasised anti-semitism and Holocaust denial, promoting the conspiracy theory that Jews seek to dominate the world through both communism and international capitalism. Under Griffin, the party's focus switched from anti-semitism towards Islamophobia. It promotes economic protectionism, Euroscepticism, and a transformation away from liberal democracy, while its social policies oppose feminism, LGBT rights, and societal permissiveness.

 

So clearly at one point in his life, Robinson was clearly a Fascist. Its wholly implausible for him to assert otherwise. There are all policies Hitler would happily have endorsed, except his commitment to doing it Undemocratically.

 

Lets look at the EDL.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Defence_League

The EDL's reputation was damaged in 2011 after supporters were arrested plotting to bomb mosques and links were revealed with Norwegian far-right mass murderer Anders Breivik. The group established formal links with two far-right parties that broke away from the BNP, the British Freedom Party and then the British Democratic Party. In 2013 Robinson—supported by the Quilliam think tank—left the group; he claimed that it had become too extreme, and established Pegida UK. Following his departure, the group began to fragment into smaller, regional organisations.

 

So he spends another 2 years in the EDL, knowning of its links to Brevick and terrorism?

 

So he founds pegida UK, which has links to the German nationalist organization. Now Americans might view that as just another teapartyist organisation, but there have been plenty of Germans whom have asserted the core organization includes Neo Nazi's. You undoubtedly know more about that than myself, but again, the Wiki page implies the only reason people dont call it fascist, is because fascism is illegal in Germany.

 

And lastly, he even succeeds in turning a London tragedy into a lot of divisive crap with an undercurrent of ethnic divisiveness. In fact, we do actually know how many died in Grenfell tower. Ive also yet to hear any evidence from the inquiry, and ive been listening in from time to time, and ive yet to hear any evidence of the presence of any illegal immigrants. But of course, never let a good opportunity go to waste. If he had been around in 1912 he would have used the Titanic disaster as an example of what happens when a lot of migrants travel travel en mass.

 

 

 

People want to criticise Muslim culture, fine. Ill happily support their right to do so. Just find a cheerleader whom hasn't spent his time on the front line with Fascist's is all im saying. Yes, DK may be right, the media always calls the political right fascists. By the same token, they sometimes are even correct.

Edited August 8, 2018 by Stuart Galbraith

[Stuart Galbraith]

 

 

 

 

I think its more to do with the fact that Robinson is, though many ignore it, just what Chris says. A lowlife white Fascist. It doesnt mean he is guilty, equally it doesn't mean he should be given special treatment because it suits some people to think he is a different person than he is.

Is there something organic about being white that would differentiate a white fascist from say a purple fascist, or is it your bigotry oozing through as well?

 

 

 

low-life? Well, working class hooligan is what I would describe Yaxley-Lennon/Robinson as. He certainly looks the part. A guy from the lower classes, that of course the burgoise self-proclaimed "gentle" men look down upon and sneeze at, because Tommy does not act like they do and is not from their class. TR gives a face to the working class (well maybe unemployed class nowadays) and the problems they face. Which among other things have been pockets of islamic parallel societies, that did as they pleased and were ignored by the fine middle classes, because of fear of being labeled racists, if they had actually started to follow the leads and tip-offs. It looks to me so far at least.

 

 

a fascist? How so? He loudly left the EDL when it shifted towards (neo)nazi ideology and racism. He certainly does not like islam, but I havent seen him wanting to implement a totalitarian state so far. Maybe I have missed it?

 

 

If Tommy Robinson is right with all his issues he brings forth is to be debated. Intruding in court trials is certainly the wrong thing to do of course and hurting his cause I think. Having him effectively locked in solitary, although he was not considered as dangerous or anything is to be investigated if it was correct by HM Prsion Services or not. So far the original trial has been sent back to square one for a long list of reasons. I guess TR is going to sue against the prison service and the court. But the mills of justice work slowly and this is going to take years clearing this up and getting at all the CYA gov clerks that were involved. And I doubt it will all be cleared satisfactorily in the end.

 

Robinson has learnt something over the last couple of months and has now moved from the unemployed working class to the working class.

 

It became evident that putting items on the internet and telling people his speech had been restricted earned him money. All the ranting he made when he came out of prison was aimed at the US market.

 

His claims of his treatment in prison to a UK audience were ludicrous and quickly shown to be lies but the in the US it was lapped up. Shit thrown through the door of his cell was accepted by people who didn't know that in the UK cell doors are solid. When this was pointed out it turned to windows but as there is a massive drugs problem in UK prison and the use of drones to deliver them, access to the outside of cell is greatly restricted. Looking at Onley it is a two story building and unless Robinson had a cross of St George hung from his window it would have been difficult to locate (and you don't want to throw shit through the wrong window). Robinson's cell was opposite a mosque, and this was lapped up by the US audience. Only one problem, there is no mosque. It goes on and on.

 

As a result, these donations to Robinson to fight the good fight have been flooding in. He has been stopped from talking, on he hasn't, you can't shut him up.

 

 

He has form for this before. Last time he was locked up he went on a hunger strike, supposedly because he was made to eat what he considered as Halal.

https://www.lutontoday.co.uk/news/crime/edl-leader-on-hunger-strike-in-custody-1-3028437

 

Interestingly, at the protest at which he was arrested for hitting someone, he dressed as a Rabbi, for comic potential presumably.

 

A year later he was claiming to be a zionist. Maybe he figures it plays better to gullible Americans.

[Harold Jones]

As a result, these donations to Robinson to fight the good fight have been flooding in. He has been stopped from talking, on he hasn't, you can't shut him up.

 

I would guess that less than 1% of US adults could tell you who Tommy Robinson is, but that if one or two percent of that number donate to his cause that's still a decent chunk of change.

[rmgill]

It became evident that putting items on the internet and telling people his speech had been restricted earned him money.

Just because you assert it doesn't demonstrate why it is the case. I've seen plenty of assertions with no evidence presented about what someone is and is not here. Including by British Media when they refer to PJW and Sargon of Akkad as Alt-right. Robinson seems to be an extension of that further rightwards. I've yet to actually see someone present him being an actual racist.

 

Also he certainly looks to have been traumatized by his stay in prison with an added loss of weight from the stay.

[rmgill]

Robinson joined the BNP and left after a year after implausibly saying he didnt know non white people couldnt join.

Why is that implausable? Were you a member once? Do you have your finger on the pulse of all British political parties from your comfy chair?

 

That kind of like joining the Nazi party and not expecting to bait jews.

So the Scottish National Party is a bunch of Scottish racists?

 

ANY national party is by default white racist is that it?

 

I've heard folks labeling UKIP as by default racist Stuart. The same goes for anyone who supported Brexit.

[rmgill]

OK, so its wikilinks with all the attendent inaccuracies that apply. If anyone can refute any of these, Ill happily remove them (Heck, ill go and alter the wiki entry myself)

 

 

then:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_National_Party

It promotes biological racism and the white genocide conspiracy theory, calling for global racial separatism and condemning interracial relationships. Under Tyndall, the BNP emphasised anti-semitism and Holocaust denial, promoting the conspiracy theory that Jews seek to dominate the world through both communism and international capitalism. Under Griffin, the party's focus switched from anti-semitism towards Islamophobia. It promotes economic protectionism, Euroscepticism, and a transformation away from liberal democracy, while its social policies oppose feminism, LGBT rights, and societal permissiveness.

You DO realize that wikipedia also has inaccuracies right?

 

 

So clearly at one point in his life, Robinson was clearly a Fascist. Its wholly implausible for him to assert otherwise. There are all policies Hitler would happily have endorsed, except his commitment to doing it Undemocratically.

So you're a socialist communist right? Labor Party affiliations right? You've been carrying their water here for years. Corbyn has links to the Soviets as a spy. You're good with this right? You're also an antisemite too right? Because we've seen how Labor has an antisemitism issue right now.

 

 

 

 

People want to criticise Muslim culture, fine. Ill happily support their right to do so. Just find a cheerleader whom hasn't spent his time on the front line with Fascist's is all im saying. Yes, DK may be right, the media always calls the political right fascists. By the same token, they sometimes are even correct.

I'll point out for another bloody time.

EVERYONE WHO CRITICIZES ISLAM IS BRANDED A RACIST!

 

Even people from Muslim countries. See also Maajid Nawaz and Ayaan Hirsi Ali. The left labels Ben Shapiro a Nazi. He's an Orthodox Jew for FFS. And Milo has been labled racist when he has a black husband.

 

Racist and Fascist have CEASED to mean anything at this point with out some CLEAR statements. As I've pointed out before look at what they ACTUALLY espouse for policy. Just pointing to someone as being X because they were in such and such party for a year is insane at this point.

Edited August 8, 2018 by rmgill

[Stuart Galbraith]

Jesus Christ Ryan, its the British National Party. The clues is in the bloody name. The Brownshirts, the Fascists, the Aryans, The National Front, the master fucking race. Even Robinson, whom you regard as an authority, says they are too right wing for him.

 

 

 

Here is a quick history. Watch it, then you have no excuse for not understanding quite whom these people are.Griffin is avowedly an antisemite. What part of 'Nazi' do I need to further elucidate Ryan?

Edited August 8, 2018 by Stuart Galbraith

[Chris Werb]

Stuart, my late father, a REME WO2 (who was an actual WW2 British Army soldier, not a pretend one) had an expression for what you are trying to do. "You can't educate pork."

[rmgill]

Jesus Christ Ryan, its the British National Party. The clues is in the bloody name.

And the Scottish National Party? They're a bunch of nazi's as well?

 

Or are they different despite the name? If they're different then why should the BNP be presumed to be a bunch of Nazi's when the SNP isn't a bunch of Nazis? See the logic fault yet?

 

The Brownshirts, the Fascists, the Aryans, The National Front, the master fucking race. Even Robinson, whom you regard as an authority, says they are too right wing for him.

 

So now you're going to give something Robinson some credit?

 

 

 

I'm not arguing that the BNP isn't identitarian Stuart. I'm pointing out that your default response of why, is inconsistent.

Edited August 8, 2018 by rmgill

[rmgill]

Stuart, my late father, a REME WO2 (who was an actual WW2 British Army soldier, not a pretend one) had an expression for what you are trying to do. "You can't educate pork."

You've had Americans AND Canadians and a Venezuelan ALL pointing out faults in your side's logic on this vis a vis freedom concepts and we're the pork? I pointed out PRECISE areas where you and several others said was one thing when clearly it was not based on the judgement of your highest appeals court. If it's not pointing out things that are open to interpretation as ABSOLUTE fact it's insults and logical fallacies.

 

 

 

Seriously, when you shifted leftwards was this after a change in diet? Did you swear off meat or something?

Edited August 8, 2018 by rmgill

[Stuart Galbraith]

 

Jesus Christ Ryan, its the British National Party. The clues is in the bloody name.

And the Scottish National Party? They're a bunch of nazi's as well?

 

Or are they different despite the name? If they're different then why should the BNP be presumed to be a bunch of Nazi's when the SNP isn't a bunch of Nazis? See the logic fault yet?

 

The Brownshirts, the Fascists, the Aryans, The National Front, the master fucking race. Even Robinson, whom you regard as an authority, says they are too right wing for him.

 

So now you're going to give something Robinson some credit?

 

 

 

I'm not arguing that the BNP isn't identitarian Stuart. I'm pointing out that your default response of why, is inconsistent.

 

 

Oh look, there is a German sports and social club, off to light a bonfire to dry themselves after skinny dipping in the Spree. Nothing to see here, move along.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uBEfcGNMd8

 

 

 

 

Stuart, my late father, a REME WO2 (who was an actual WW2 British Army soldier, not a pretend one) had an expression for what you are trying to do. "You can't educate pork."

 

You are probably right Chris. I make the mistake then when I see someone whom is intelligent (and Ryan is, despite his present dunderheadedness) is possible to convince by logical argument. When its clear the shutters have come down and the store manager isnt in.

 

Robinson is a Fascist. Its clear from past associations, past actions, and the coded language that he says. That he doesn't overtly say it, is just one more indication of how British fascists have become more media savvy. Now other people can believe differently. Im happy for them. I personally hope they enjoy their Torchlight parades when they get them, because with this kind of muddle headedness, rest assured they are coming.

[Briganza]

Stuart, my late father, a REME WO2 (who was an actual WW2 British Army soldier, not a pretend one) had an expression for what you are trying to do. "You can't educate pork."

Any one who thinks a dog catcher is part of government has lost the plot.

[Briganza]

 

Jesus Christ Ryan, its the British National Party. The clues is in the bloody name.

And the Scottish National Party? They're a bunch of nazi's as well?

 

Or are they different despite the name? If they're different then why should the BNP be presumed to be a bunch of Nazi's when the SNP isn't a bunch of Nazis? See the logic fault yet?

 

The Brownshirts, the Fascists, the Aryans, The National Front, the master fucking race. Even Robinson, whom you regard as an authority, says they are too right wing for him.

 

So now you're going to give something Robinson some credit?

 

 

 

I'm not arguing that the BNP isn't identitarian Stuart. I'm pointing out that your default response of why, is inconsistent.

 

The SNP have a lot of problems with extreme nationalism within their ranks but comparing them to the BNP reflects more on your inability to comprehend the difference between the two groups.

[Briganza]

 

It became evident that putting items on the internet and telling people his speech had been restricted earned him money.

Just because you assert it doesn't demonstrate why it is the case. I've seen plenty of assertions with no evidence presented about what someone is and is not here. Including by British Media when they refer to PJW and Sargon of Akkad as Alt-right. Robinson seems to be an extension of that further rightwards. I've yet to actually see someone present him being an actual racist.

 

Also he certainly looks to have been traumatized by his stay in prison with an added loss of weight from the stay.

 

A partition has been set up to try and dissuade PayPal from processing funds to Robinson as doing so would contravene PayPal's policy.

 

Robinson has a history of using hunger strikes. Or do you want the prisons to use force feeding. His last hunger strike was because he didn't want to eat halal food but ignored the vegetarian option or options that couldn't possibly be halal. Look up the menus in UK prisons it is another claim by Robinson that is easily disproved.

 

What was that saying about prison, if you can't do the time don't do the crime.

 

Robinson is paranoid.

[DKTanker]

The SNP have a lot of problems with extreme nationalism within their ranks but comparing them to the BNP reflects more on your inability to comprehend the difference between the two groups.

 

Stuart pointed out that having "Nationalist" in the organization title was enough to satisfy the definition of it being a fascist organization. He didn't mention degrees of fascism, or that one fascist group might be righteous while another not. He simply stated that it was "right there in the name", it was a statement of absolute fact. Not Ryan's problem that Stuart wasn't clear, and it certainly doesn't present a reason for personal attacks. Maybe you and Stuart could get together and perhaps make a chart outlining why one nationalist group is acceptable fascism and another is unacceptable. While you're at it, could one or both of you answer this question, is it possible for an organization to be fascist without using the term "Nationalist" in their organizational title?

Edited August 9, 2018 by DKTanker

[DKTanker]

A partition has been set up to try and dissuade PayPal from processing funds to Robinson as doing so would contravene PayPal's policy.

 

Petition maybe? Why don't you guys just channel Orwell and memory hole the guy? You don't like his speech*, you obviously want his speech quashed, and you see no redeeming qualities. Might I suggest a Polonium enema?

 

*I really have little idea of what Robinson has said or done, nor do I care. This I do know, we have our own numbers of people that say things many people believe is beyond the pale. Generally we just let them rant on allowing them to show themselves as the fools they are. I say generally because we too have our Left Wing Extremists that are hell bent on quashing speech which they find unacceptable. That is to say all speech that isn't supportive of the Leftist cause.

[Stuart Galbraith]

 

The SNP have a lot of problems with extreme nationalism within their ranks but comparing them to the BNP reflects more on your inability to comprehend the difference between the two groups.

 

Stuart pointed out that having "Nationalist" in the organization title was enough to satisfy the definition of it being a fascist organization. He didn't mention degrees of fascism, or that one fascist group might be righteous while another not. He simply stated that it was "right there in the name", it was a statement of absolute fact. Not Ryan's problem that Stuart wasn't clear, and it certainly doesn't present a reason for personal attacks. Maybe you and Stuart could get together and perhaps make a chart outlining why one nationalist group is acceptable fascism and another is unacceptable. While you're at it, could one or both of you answer this question, is it possible for an organization to be fascist without using the term "Nationalist" in their organizational title?

 

 

I would have thought what they say, their antisemitism, their policy of sending everyone home that isnt white would be enough to do that.

 

But as far as im concerned, nationalists are hop skip and a jump away from being Fascists, a perception that doesnt seem to bother Nick Griffin any. The main reason why he calls his party national instead of Fascist is because the latter still has negative conotations of Oswald Mosley and 5 years of Strategic Bombing. Though happily the electorate doesnt seem fooled by it.

 

Is that bias on my part against nationalists? Perhaps it is. My family, or at least some of them, come from Northern Ireland, where their fellow Ulstermen turned Nationalism into an Art Form, and a very violent, bloodletting nationalism it was too. But if you want another example of nationalism, here is the welsh variety.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mudiad_Amddiffyn_Cymru

 

Are the Scottish National Party in the same league? No. OTOH, they dont actually have a state of their own to manage, and taken to their logical conclusion the SNP's fiscal policies would do a very good emulation of Venezuela. But regardless of that, there are similar sectarian issues in parts of Scotland, that have also given rise to Nationalists, of a similar kind to the BNP.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_National_Liberation_Army

 

I hope that elucidates my suspcion of Nationalism in general. Patriotism is a different matter, but then patriotism is not restricted to ethnic background, or at least not in the British experience.

 

Top and bottom of it is, Ryan here wants to believe Robinson is a working class hero unfairly maligned by a Big Brother Socialist Government. And every time we haul up some evidence to demonstrate 'no, this is not so', its sumarily dismissed because we are picking at straws apparently. I do not personally attack him for that, but I do have to express incredulity at how little Americans seemingly understand my country.

 

Heck we even speak in English. We arent THAT hard to understand you know.

Edited August 9, 2018 by Stuart Galbraith

[Jeff]

 

Stuart, my late father, a REME WO2 (who was an actual WW2 British Army soldier, not a pretend one) had an expression for what you are trying to do. "You can't educate pork."

Any one who thinks a dog catcher is part of government has lost the plot.

 

Not sure if I'm missing something here but in the US, the "dog catcher" is called the Animal Control Officer and is an employee of government, usually municipal or county government.

[Harold Jones]

 

 

Stuart, my late father, a REME WO2 (who was an actual WW2 British Army soldier, not a pretend one) had an expression for what you are trying to do. "You can't educate pork."

Any one who thinks a dog catcher is part of government has lost the plot.

 

Not sure if I'm missing something here but in the US, the "dog catcher" is called the Animal Control Officer and is an employee of government, usually municipal or county government.

 

 

I believe that in the UK 'the government' means specifically the Prime Minister and their various appointees. In the US we use the phrase much more widely. It's an example of how much our 'common' language and culture has diverged in the more or less four centuries since the first English Colonies were established here.

Edited August 9, 2018 by Harold Jones

[Panzermann]

 

Jesus Christ Ryan, its the British National Party. The clues is in the bloody name.

And the Scottish National Party? They're a bunch of nazi's as well?

 

Or are they different despite the name? If they're different then why should the BNP be presumed to be a bunch of Nazi's when the SNP isn't a bunch of Nazis? See the logic fault yet?

 

The Brownshirts, the Fascists, the Aryans, The National Front, the master fucking race. Even Robinson, whom you regard as an authority, says they are too right wing for him.

 

So now you're going to give something Robinson some credit?

 

 

 

I'm not arguing that the BNP isn't identitarian Stuart. I'm pointing out that your default response of why, is inconsistent.

 

The interwebs seems to have eaten my answer to Stuart.

 

So in short:

 

He left the BNP, because of that and later left the EDL he had founded, because they slided towards nazi stuff.

Robinson turning his back on nazis twice makes him a nazi?

 

 

And I think nobody here likes the BNP.