Josh Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 46 minutes ago, Colin said: I have seen cases with 6 months and large legal team have the case tossed, because the evidence is inadmissible. Not sure how anyone can put together enough evidence of fraudulent practices in a couple of weeks, that would stand a court test. Trumps legal team also appears to be full of out of date high rollers and few worker bees, which certainly would not help. One can question how many people with ID, but not citizenship voted? The Dems have no interests in fixing the voting system as the weaknesses generally favour them. Plus the US election process is screwed up with 50 different sets of rules and systems. At the very least the whole system needs a cleanup and minimum standards that all States need to meet, particularly on electronic voting and mail in ballots. Fraud and voter manipulation has been the norm in democracies, not the exception, hence most of the existing rules like closing the pubs while the polls are open. Re, the bold part, the swing states involved had GOP legislations. If they wanted to pass new election laws, they can (and will). The constitution largely removes the US federal government from having any say in how a state runs its elections, so standardization isn't a readily achievable goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 A Federal commission could review the practices of each State and elicit recommendations and lessons learned from the States. The report could make a series of recommendations to a minimum standard to be achieved. That would give voters in each State the information they need to push for changes. It generally takes a lot of effort to change laws, Acts and regulation. For that to happen you need a Champion on the political side and enough voter interest to force the politicians to stay at it. Most of the changes would be technical and likley to complex to be wrapped up in neat soundbites. I have also noted that many politicians are happy to go on about an issue but to do the bare minimum to change it, as they can milk that cow for a long time. We had a major environmental issue here (Derelict boats) and it took about 15 years to get the changes needed to be made, despite parties in power that were "environmental conscious" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivanhoe Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKsL86miWdg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWB Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Self-styled militia members planned on storming the U.S. Capitol days in advance of Jan. 6 attack, court documents say Quote Self-styled militia members from Virginia, Ohio and other states made plans to storm the U.S. Capitol days in advance of the Jan. 6 attack, and then communicated in real time as they breached the building on opposite sides and talked about hunting for lawmakers, according to court documents filed Tuesday. While authorities have charged more than 100 individuals in the riot, details in the new allegations against three U.S. military veterans offer a disturbing look at what they allegedly said to one another before, during and after the attack — statements that indicate a degree of preparation and determination to rush deep into the halls and tunnels of Congress to make “citizens’ arrests” of elected officials. U.S. authorities charged an apparent leader of the Oath Keepers extremist group, Thomas Edward Caldwell, 66, of Berryville, Va., in the attack, alleging that the Navy veteran helped organize a ring of dozens who coordinated their movements as they “stormed the castle” to disrupt the confirmation of President-elect Joe Biden’s electoral college victory. https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/legal-issues/conspiracy-oath-keeper-arrest-capitol-riot/2021/01/19/fb84877a-5a4f-11eb-8bcf-3877871c819d_story.html They were going to Rampage anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R011 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 In other words, a bunch of LARPing loud mouths found they unexpectedly could try to fulfil their fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitflegal Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 So as a supporter of Trump's policies and a believer that he did a lot of good things while in office can we all agree that at the end on his last day he went out as a bitch? Bombshell document releases with the usual redactedness to uselessness, pardons of rappers and Democrats and removing his anti-lobbying EO seem like a major kick to the nuts of his supporters and I suspect have eliminated him from 2024 contention. Which is probably not a bad thing for the Republicans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivanhoe Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 I haven't scoured the list of pardons yet, but sentence commutation for Kwame Kilpatrick is a bad idea. As for the rappers, seems pretty dumb to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 42 minutes ago, nitflegal said: So as a supporter of Trump's policies and a believer that he did a lot of good things while in office can we all agree that at the end on his last day he went out as a bitch? Bombshell document releases with the usual redactedness to uselessness, pardons of rappers and Democrats and removing his anti-lobbying EO seem like a major kick to the nuts of his supporters and I suspect have eliminated him from 2024 contention. Which is probably not a bad thing for the Republicans. Any poll for the GOP primary would still put him way at the top of the stack. https://morningconsult.com/2021/01/13/trump-2024-gop-primary-polling/ I think the reason Moscow Mitch is willing to gut Trump in the impeachment is because he wants even the possibility of Trump running removed. Trump teasing a run sucks all the air out of the GOP room; Trump actually running probably sees him win the primary with not great odds of winning the general. I suspect even Trump being indicted (which I think is better than 50/50) wouldn't remove him has the favorite in a Republican primary for the foreseeable future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitflegal Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 6 minutes ago, Josh said: Any poll for the GOP primary would still put him way at the top of the stack. https://morningconsult.com/2021/01/13/trump-2024-gop-primary-polling/ I think the reason Moscow Mitch is willing to gut Trump in the impeachment is because he wants even the possibility of Trump running removed. Trump teasing a run sucks all the air out of the GOP room; Trump actually running probably sees him win the primary with not great odds of winning the general. I suspect even Trump being indicted (which I think is better than 50/50) wouldn't remove him has the favorite in a Republican primary for the foreseeable future. He's at the top of the stack now since he effectively has no competition for non-swamp well known Republican. Watching the various conservative on-line commentators start pointing out his flaws I don't think that holds. But we will see! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EchoFiveMike Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 There are no suitably pro-American politicians, Trump was as close as they come, and he seems to be more show than substance. They're all too concerned about being called racist by people who hate them and won't vote for them under any condition. S/F....Ken M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitflegal Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 On 1/17/2021 at 9:27 PM, Skywalkre said: What prominent Conservative voices were kicked off? Limbaugh? He shut down his account on his own. Looking up to see who was kicked off the best list I could find was this one from Forbes. I wouldn't call any of them prominent and they're all clearly Trump fanboys. Everything I've seen is those 70k accounts were nobodies. The last I saw on here was that one website, AR15.com, is back up. The banks and companies cutting off business/donations are cutting ties with Rs who voted to contest the election on the Hill. An election, as already noted, that was clearly won by Biden and which has zero credible evidence to be challenged at this point (and all the same issues apply that I already stated - sowing uncertainty at a time when shit is already bad and could get a lot worse when you have nothing to stand on is pure idiocy and the businesses are tired of it). Some companies did a blanket cut off of donations to all Republicans but that was until said companies could do a review of everything. This isn't about culling Conservatism, it's about standing up to stupidity at this point and I can't find any fault with anyone but the Rs still foolish enough to go along with this asshatery. As of just now, do Michelle Malkin and Gateway Pundit count? 'Cause they got suspended today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angrybk Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, nitflegal said: So as a supporter of Trump's policies and a believer that he did a lot of good things while in office can we all agree that at the end on his last day he went out as a bitch? Bombshell document releases with the usual redactedness to uselessness, pardons of rappers and Democrats and removing his anti-lobbying EO seem like a major kick to the nuts of his supporters and I suspect have eliminated him from 2024 contention. Which is probably not a bad thing for the Republicans. The Bannon pardon was kinda the most messed up one. His crime was defrauding a lot of Trump voters. Edited January 21, 2021 by Angrybk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R011 Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Well, Trump left office as scheduled at noon. As he promised when he finally accepted he lost the election, he left voluntarily. Contrary to some who said he couldn't be trusted not to do something seriously nefarious, there was no declaration of martial law, no nuclear war, no call for insurgency or riot, no pardons of Capitol rioters. There were no riots today or even significant demonstrations. It's all been anticlimactic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivanhoe Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 11 minutes ago, R011 said: Well, Trump left office as scheduled at noon. As he promised when he finally accepted he lost the election, he left voluntarily. Contrary to some who said he couldn't be trusted not to do something seriously nefarious, there was no declaration of martial law, no nuclear war, no call for insurgency or riot, no pardons of Capitol rioters. There were no riots today or even significant demonstrations. It's all been anticlimactic. Worst fascist dictator ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angrybk Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Yeah except for the part where he dragged the results out over two months with complete bullshit accusations of voter fraud and then incited a mob of his followers to storm the Capitol Building and then flew off in a snit after pardoning every criminal he could think of but hey, what a mensch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R011 Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 You mean using every legal avenue open to him to overturn an election he and a third of Americans believe was fraudulent? Ask demonstrators to "peacefully" - his exact wording - assemble and petition Congress and whose pardons were certainly no more controversial than many presidents, like Bill Clinton. Trump was supposedly going to pardon people like Assange, Snowden, the Capitol rioters, himself, his family, Guiliani etc. He pardoned a few close associates, a couple of entertainment figures with minor offences, and some people recommended to him by justice reform advocates. No terrorists, no spies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiloMorai Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 7 hours ago, R011 said: You mean using every legal avenue open to him to overturn an election he and a third of Americans believe was fraudulent? You mean the 1/3 he convinced there was voter fraud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 7 hours ago, R011 said: You mean using every legal avenue open to him to overturn an election he and a third of Americans believe was fraudulent? Ask demonstrators to "peacefully" - his exact wording - assemble and petition Congress and whose pardons were certainly no more controversial than many presidents, like Bill Clinton. Trump was supposedly going to pardon people like Assange, Snowden, the Capitol rioters, himself, his family, Guiliani etc. He pardoned a few close associates, a couple of entertainment figures with minor offences, and some people recommended to him by justice reform advocates. No terrorists, no spies. By personally calling election officials in individual states and lobbying them to overturn the electors and/or find votes, one might say he even used means beyond legal avenues. Or at least encouraged others to use means beyond their legal power. It's also worth pointing out that Trump has been undermining the voting process since he took office. He disputed the popular vote in 2016 and said it was off by 3 million. He also disputed his inauguration size as well. The fact that Trump went out with a whimper probably has a lot to do with the Capitol riot drying up his congressional support. You'll notice the same state that Trump "clearly won" wasted no time certifying the two new Dem senators and that absolutely no one contested it, even though it was the same people, machines, etc that handled the presidential election. That's because no one in Congress had any stomach for Trumpian "fraud!" bullshit after being forced to hide in a basement and Trump himself didn't really give a shit about a GOP election if he didn't get to run the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RETAC21 Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 9 hours ago, R011 said: no nuclear war I was promised a nuclear war four years ago by the pundits, I feel cheated... 😮 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seahawk Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 No worries the chances have increased with Bidden in power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 11 hours ago, Angrybk said: Yeah except for the part where he dragged the results out over two months with complete bullshit accusations of voter fraud and then incited a mob of his followers to storm the Capitol Building and then flew off in a snit after pardoning every criminal he could think of but hey, what a mensch. Now do Gore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn239 Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) 12 hours ago, Angrybk said: Yeah except for the part where he dragged the results out over two months with complete bullshit accusations of voter fraud and then incited a mob of his followers to storm the Capitol Building and then flew off in a snit after pardoning every criminal he could think of but hey, what a mensch. I was told by CNN for two years that Trump would pardon himself and his kids. When CNN crack addicts realize they've been fed a line, how do they process it? Cultists reach the day after the end of the world was supposed to happen just go back and "recalculate". But, for a CNN addict, what is the exact mental process when they've watched 300 discussions about Trump pardoning himself, and then it doesn't happen? My favorite today was CNN telling me Trump had no distribution plan. Alison is literally saying this into the camera, and right beside her on the screen is, literally, CNN's own tally of Trump having distributed 36 million doses to the states in a month. Edited January 21, 2021 by glenn239 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunday Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Gents, please do not feed the troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BansheeOne Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 23 hours ago, nitflegal said: He's at the top of the stack now since he effectively has no competition for non-swamp well known Republican. Watching the various conservative on-line commentators start pointing out his flaws I don't think that holds. But we will see! I see some cautious criticism pop up in places where until a couple days ago people who advocated to accept the reality of transition, election fraud or not, were lambasted as having lost faith, RINOs, Biden voters, traitors, etc. For now though, Trump has successively been promoted from greatest president since Reagan to greatest since a hundred years, since Lincoln, and ever (I knew Reagan would get the boot from the cult eventually); and a lot of people have essentially declared to do what hardheaded folks who run out out arguments usually do, put reality on ignore (no more news of any sort, no more political debate on or off the net, and so on). If the fate of GWB is any indication though, Trump's supporters of today will hate his guts in about eight years when their next great hope tells them to. Which is why the various suggestions to "deprogram" them are really quite silly; most will be automatically overwritten eventually. Not necessarily for the better, mind, but then there's no guarantee that a "deprogrammed" ex-cultist of any sort will never fall for seduction of another kind either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 4 hours ago, RETAC21 said: I was promised a nuclear war four years ago by the pundits, I feel cheated... 😮 I feel your pain. I've been busily fitting out my inner refuge for months now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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