Yama Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 (edited) How a full sized forest with one tree type shadowing most of the land below is more diverse than a field with many different plants and birds with sun? For example, amount of dead trees is massively larger in natural state forest. That keeps up insect abundancy, which in turns feeds the birds, small reptilian and mammalian predators, and so on. In recent years, we have observed massive loss of insect abundancy. In turn, bird abundancy has also taken a big hit - something like 1/3 less birds today than in the '70s, in case of North America as I recall. Of which there is 'no evidence' as claimed by esteemed Mr Watts... There is no single reason for the decline, but major part of it is because decline in natural state woodlands. Edited November 5, 2019 by Yama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yama Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 We are a very suburban state and we now have deer (in huge amounts), coyotes (I can sit in my condo living room and listen to them howl and cry to each other at sunset and listen to them tearing a neighborhood cat to pieces at night), bears, bobcats, fishercats, turkeys, beaver, osprey, hawks, bald eagles, salmon, shad, etc. How much diversity is diversity? From what you say, we'll never get "proper" diversity back, so why bother trying for your definition? Maybe the coyotes are trying to kill your neighbours cat, because there are not enough for them to eat in the wilderness anymore, hm? 'My' definition of biodiversity (actually, the scientific one) is important because once you trigger massive species loss, you risk eliminating some 'keystone species' which are crucial on upkeeping the ecosystem and them being gone will trigger further extinctions. Often we don't even realize which species are those, until afterwards. Some populous insect species for example serve double role in the ecosystem: on the one hand they pollinate plants, on the other they are food for the insectivores. Lose them, you lose those plants, and the songbirds which were food for the hawks, and so on... The West needs to devote its entire GDP and accumulated resources to return to a pre-white occupied/ influenced condition. Nobody's demanding that, but hey, lets retort to strawman arguments when we no longer have real ones, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yama Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 How much does your electricity really cost? Weird, here new wind farms are built without government subsidy. Is this some very old graph? I am not huge fan of wind power myself though - I don't think it can resolve energy issue, it is too unreliable in large scale. Also turbines themselves are an eyesore and risk for the birds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soren Ras Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 There is civil unrest in Chile The government raised fare on the metro 30 cents ($.04 US). The students want better pensions, minimum wage plus electricity prices have risen. Probably because of some Greta friendly policies. I just hope nothing happens to all the telescopes that have a home there. Seems unlikely. It would take a truly remarkable level of commitment on the part of the revolting ilk to get there, given that all the telescopes are in the mountains next to the driest desert in the world. The altitude also militates against any strenuous activity like rioting and vandalism. I suppose someone could drive up there and socially engineer access to one or more telescopes easily enough, but once inside the control room, it would take serious effort to do anything worse than smash a couple of easily replaced computer monitors. If you somehow got access to the guidance computer and you knew how to override the safety on some or the older telescopes (I believe the newer ones are constructed to be physically incapable of moving below the horizon, but on the older ones, there was only a software safety, that I recall quite vividly from the safety lecture I received when I was observing there), you could theoretically program the quite powerful motors controlling the telescope movements to drive the telescope into the ground, which would do significant damage to the optics. But now you are talking about an inside job, which is another matter. --Soren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 That's not the case around here. The forests have grown back where fields used to be, you can see the stone walls disappearing into the trees, and they are in no way monotypic and cared for in any way.Few decades of trees growing does not recover biodiversity. It takes centuries.Finland is the remotest and most sparsely populated country in EU. 73% of the land surface area is forest. Yet only few percent of that is natural state forest. We are a very suburban state and we now have deer (in huge amounts), coyotes (I can sit in my condo living room and listen to them howl and cry to each other at sunset and listen to them tearing a neighborhood cat to pieces at night), bears, bobcats, fishercats, turkeys, beaver, osprey, hawks, bald eagles, salmon, shad, etc. How much diversity is diversity? From what you say, we'll never get "proper" diversity back, so why bother trying for your definition? The "moving goalpost gig" of the left. Keeps a manufactured "crisis" front and center as mentioned in DKTanker's #1074 post. I have yet to seen any of these environmental wackos giving up electricity, indoor plumbing, and public sanitation! Nor have I've seen these delusional individuals walk to an environmental meeting held outdoors without computers, power, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 How much does your electricity really cost? Weird, here new wind farms are built without government subsidy. Is this some very old graph? I am not huge fan of wind power myself though - I don't think it can resolve energy issue, it is too unreliable in large scale. Also turbines themselves are an eyesore and risk for the birds. Not trying to be argumentative, but are these new wind farms you are referring to being given federal, state, local tax breaks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R011 Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 We are a very suburban state and we now have deer (in huge amounts), coyotes (I can sit in my condo living room and listen to them howl and cry to each other at sunset and listen to them tearing a neighborhood cat to pieces at night), bears, bobcats, fishercats, turkeys, beaver, osprey, hawks, bald eagles, salmon, shad, etc. How much diversity is diversity? From what you say, we'll never get "proper" diversity back, so why bother trying for your definition?Maybe the coyotes are trying to kill your neighbours cat, because there are not enough for them to eat in the wilderness anymore, hm?'My' definition of biodiversity (actually, the scientific one) is important because once you trigger massive species loss, you risk eliminating some 'keystone species' which are crucial on upkeeping the ecosystem and them being gone will trigger further extinctions. Often we don't even realize which species are those, until afterwards. Some populous insect species for example serve double role in the ecosystem: on the one hand they pollinate plants, on the other they are food for the insectivores. Lose them, you lose those plants, and the songbirds which were food for the hawks, and so on... The West needs to devote its entire GDP and accumulated resources to return to a pre-white occupied/ influenced condition.Nobody's demanding that, but hey, lets retort to strawman arguments when we no longer have real ones, right?You clearly don't realize that your complaints about new ecological diversities imply just this. Part of the cognitive dissonance in the climate and environmental movement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWB Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 Landfill begins burying non-recyclable Wind Turbine Blades Waste management experts estimate they’ll take hundreds of years to biodegrade Hundreds of giant windmill blades are being shipped to a landfill in Wyoming to be buried because they simply can’t be recycled.Local media reports several wind farms in the state are sending over 900 un-reusable blades to the Casper Regional Landfill to be buried. While nearly 90 percent of old or decommissioned wind turbines, like the motor housing, can be refurbished or at least crushed, fiberglass windmill blades present a problem due to their size and strength. “Our crushing equipment is not big enough to crush them,” a landfill representative told NPR. Prior to burying the cumbersome, sometimes nearly 300-foot long blades, the landfill has to cut them up into smaller pieces onsite and stack them in order to save space during transportation. To make matters worse, the blades aren’t exactly compostable. The Casper Sold Waste Manager tells Wyoming News Now they’ll take hundreds of years to biodegrade. “So Casper happens to be, I think it is, the biggest landfill facility in the state of Wyoming. These blades are really big, and they take up a lot of airspace, and our unlined area is very, very large, and it’s going to last hundreds of years.” As if that’s not bad enough, NPR reports researchers estimate the US will soon have to grapple with over 720,000 tons of blades over the next 20 years, “a figure that doesn’t include newer, taller higher-capacity versions.” So much for saving the environment.https://www.educationviews.org/landfill-begins-burying-non-recyclable-wind-turbine-blades/?fbclid=IwAR16zATvPrn7Dl31VcN6KJzhXY8rZPFfo4Gm7OswGTAsVqse22RLhtHHDkM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiloMorai Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 JWB, how do you dispose of your old fiberglass boat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brasidas Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 JWB, how do you dispose of your old fiberglass boat?The answer is not taking it 500 miles from a qualified disposal facility in the midwestern plains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWB Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 JWB, how do you dispose of your old fiberglass boat?The fiber glass in boats is often recyclable. It is also far easier to chop and crush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der Zeitgeist Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 (edited) In a few years, Greta will have turned into a kind of comic-book character only to be used ironically. Swedish teenager’s face can be seen scowling disapprovingly in cafeterias and coffee corners across the land, in a bid to get Israelis to reduce usage of disposables.https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-photos-of-greta-thunberg-being-used-to-stop-israelis-using-disposables-at-work-1.8090477 Edited November 6, 2019 by Der Zeitgeist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzermann Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 Hasn't she already? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikel2 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 Hasn't she already? How dare you?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Sydney endangered by 'Catastrophic' wildfires.https://uk.news.yahoo.com/catastrophic-danger-australia-wildfires-threaten-165802207.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuYmluZy5jb20vc2VhcmNoP3E9QXVzdHJhbGlhK2NhdGFzdHJvcGhpYytkYW5nZXImZmlsdGVycz10blRJRCUzYSUyMkVFMkM0MDExLTcwNjctNDFjNS05OEZCLUZCOUJDNTA5RTM5NCUyMit0blZlcnNpb24lM2ElMjIzMjU4Njk1JTIyK3NlZ21lbnQlM2ElMjJwb3B1bGFybm93LmNhcm91c2VsJTIyK3RuQ29sJTNhJTIyNyUyMit0bk9yZGVyJTNhJTIyM2ZmZmZhYzEtZTBmMi00NTQyLWFmMzAtMTMwODQ5MTRhOTA2JTIyJmVmaXJzdD01JkZPUk09SFBOTjAx&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAMe93e-c_ukiLdvOoswGAXDDwcvmjpTsCK_TVGjpKw9sXHpPAL3tfeZMKDM9GdUZ3e235gKu2T-3B-t6hhhUd7qPOMLf0g0cneRydlWmd1J4WNh7WW0cxyfF6aOYdgTmBQ9dRLj5GeMUv3L4-aIiZSqGslRLfAhu_wfDVtbeNFD- Expecting tweet about not sweeping up enough leaves in 3, 2, 1... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucklucky Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Shouldn't Australia be a desert by now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunday Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Shouldn't Australia be a desert by now? Well, it could be said that Australia is mainly a desert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucklucky Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 So is it sand that is on fire? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunday Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Only the un-mainly parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mobius Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 They are saying many are deliberately set. So maybe some demographic problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der Zeitgeist Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) Looks like Greta has found another boat for her to sail back across the Atlantic. It's kinda hilarious that there's no way she's ever gonna be able to enter any kind of conventional airplane in the forseeable future. Edited November 13, 2019 by Der Zeitgeist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 They are saying many are deliberately set. So maybe some demographic problem. Pyromaniac Koala's probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ssnake Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Maybe the Koalas found out that lighting up Eucalyptus powered farts can propel them up to the tree tops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunday Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) At last, someone stepped up and said clearly what they think. "...These are times that call for us to do those things that we believe in, and to march, and not just to march, cause that's important to show solidarity, but then to do those things such as voter registration, get people out to vote, so that we can have people here who are truly committed to human rights, environmental rights -- climate change...believe in climate change as though it's a religion, it's not a science-- and all the things that need to be done, and there is a lot," Sen. Hirono told the crowd. https://townhall.com/tipsheet/timothymeads/2019/11/12/democrat-mazie-hirono-we-should-believe-in-climate-change-as-if-its-a-religion-not-a-science-n2556346 Edited November 13, 2019 by sunday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucklucky Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 They are saying many are deliberately set. So maybe some demographic problem. Pyromaniac Koala's probably. Can be birds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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