Brexit

[Leo Niehorster]

 

... If you pay tax, you should vote. ...

With that logic, even children — who pay VAT, state and/or local sales taxes on products — should arguably also be allowed to vote, even drink alcohol, drive cars ... be drafted.

[Ssnake]

"Kinder an die Macht"

(If it's a catchy tune, it must be true...)

[Harold Jones]

The people pushing for lowering the voting age to 16 are doing it because they think it will give them a political advantage and for no other reason. Ask those same people why if someone is mature enough to vote at 16 why they would still not be able to enter into contracts, buy and consume alcohol, smoke tobacco, smoke pot, or drive without restriction and I suspect the answer will be that clearly they are still children.

[DB]

 

But back to brexit. When is the next snap election?

 

Sadly, my crystal ball appears to be broken. At this point, anything can happen in the next half hour.

 

 

Except, of course, for the shower of shit that is currently on holiday actually making a fucking decision.

[rmgill]

 

... If you pay tax, you should vote. ...

With that logic, even children — who pay VAT, state and/or local sales taxes on products — should arguably also be allowed to vote, even drink alcohol, drive cars ... be drafted.

 

And have sex with other 'adults', which is also a direction the left is pushing.

 

Double

[rmgill]

Hey Stuart. Are you going to go find Carl and sit down and talk?

[Stuart Galbraith]

 

 

... If you pay tax, you should vote. ...

With that logic, even children — who pay VAT, state and/or local sales taxes on products — should arguably also be allowed to vote, even drink alcohol, drive cars ... be drafted.

 

 

You can join the military at 16. Bob Griffin, who used to post here as Commander, Joined the Junior Leaders when he was 16.

 

Of course they wont let you actually KILL anyone till you are 18. But if there is a national emergency.....

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/shortcuts/2013/apr/23/british-armed-forces-16-year-olds

Edited April 24, 2019 by Stuart Galbraith

[Stuart Galbraith]

Hey Stuart. Are you going to go find Carl and sit down and talk?

 

 

He knows where to find me, and Its not a long drive up from Swindon. He can ask my opinion on multifarious topics such as why Bananarama sucked and why is Donald Trump orange, whilst i work.

[Stuart Galbraith]

 

 

But back to brexit. When is the next snap election?

 

Sadly, my crystal ball appears to be broken. At this point, anything can happen in the next half hour.

 

 

Except, of course, for the shower of shit that is currently on holiday actually making a fucking decision.

 

 

I think its a liberty the buggers took a holiday at all, when the country is staring down a crisis and they created it by their own inability to achieve consensus.

 

When my father was working as a fabricator welder he was expected to stay on when there was important work to be finished, even if that was (sometimes) 10 o clock at night. I dont see why the same mindset should not be had in politics.

[Stuart Galbraith]

This is interesting, Ann Widicombe defects to Farages Brexit party.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/8925627/ann-widdecombe-quits-tories-defects-nigel-farage-brexit-party/

ANN Widdecombe has sensationally quit the Tories and defected to Nigel Farage's Brexit Party.

The ex-minister, 71, has been a member of the Conservative party for 55 years, but has put her retirement on hold to “campaign vigorously” for the European elections.

 

It will be a return to frontline politics for the Tory grandee, who served as the shadow home secretary from 1999 to 2001 after being John Major's Prisons Minister.

Ms Widdecombe is now joining Farage's fledgling party on a mandate to hurry up and get Britain out of the EU.

"The public needs to send a very clear message and that is we expect the vote to be respected so just get on with the job of getting us out of the EU,” she told the Express.

"If I am elected in Brussels my message to Juncker and company will be very simple, very loud and very clear. Nous allons (we go)."

 

 

Ms Widdecombe was earlier rumoured to be considering leaving the party after she campaigned hard for Brexit.

She was appalled by the failure to deliver on the Article 50 commitment to leave on March 29.

Earlier this month Ms Widdecombe branded Theresa May the worst Prime Minister since Anthony Eden.

She is set to contest the South West region in the upcoming European elections, which will take place next month.

 

If anyone doesnt get the significance of this, its the equivalent of Mitt Romney suddenly deciding he is a Democrat. The Conservative party is hemorrhaging long established furniture.

 

Edited April 24, 2019 by Stuart Galbraith

[Stuart Galbraith]

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/theresa-may-planning-fourth-vote-on-brexit-deal-but-tories-plot-to-change-party-rules-to-oust-her-064456247.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuYmluZy5jb20v&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAFo1hA9eLw6BU4xu6XS4fk_vUhMtmKmA6KiPvNoHugHImhOMUml2R5pRx7OWLAkjcTty3JnqZhQjP_qbFSP7NEa9r-LiWzJtcsKTxj-Zx7_zICBwgmZWdQn7YJm44TJrqj1zZSJ08VzAzXt8qyqnYgMp61r20agzuHbde8XWBJVd

Theresa May is said to be pushing ahead with plans for a fourth vote on her Brexit deal - despite Tories plotting to change party rules so they can get rid of her.

According to the Daily Mail, the Prime Minister wants to hold another vote on her deal in the next 10 days, in an attempt to stop a potential bloodbath in the upcoming EU elections.

However, her plans to thwart a resurgent Nigel Farage, whose Brexit Party has topped several polls in the past week, may be scuppered by her own MPs.

Officers of the Tory backbench 1922 Committee met in Westminster on Tuesday in an attempt to pile pressure on Mrs May to name the date of her departure.

Senior Conservatives are expected to hold further discussions today on whether to change the party rules to enable an early leadership challenge.

Oh, and Rachel Johnson, Boris's sister, runs for the opposition and newly established Change UK.

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/rachel-johnson-reveals-plans-stand-085400853.html

Rachel Johnson, sister of Boris, today revealed she is standing as a European election candidate — and took a swipe at her Brexiteer brother.

Talking exclusively to the Evening Standard, the campaigning journalist said she will stand in the South West region for Change UK, the pro-Remain party set up by The Independent Group of MPs.

She said she was taking a stand against a Brexit that would deny young people the freedoms that Brexiteers themselves enjoyed to live and work in the European Union.

Ms Johnson said she did not want to see Brexit “rubbing out my children’s prospects and chances of living and travelling and working in Europe”.

She said: “These are chances that the politicians who decided to campaign to Leave have enjoyed themselves.

“It is simply not fair — and sometimes one has to stand up and be counted. It is now that time for me.”

Ms Johnson added: “A vote to leave the EU is so important, so life-changing for the next two generations that I am impelled to stand up and be counted for what I believe in, which is that we are far better in Europe.”

Former foreign secretary Mr Johnson made his name as a journalist working in Brussels and writing about the European Commission.

Ms Johnson, a writer and journalist, said of her candidacy: “I’m honoured they have picked me to stand in the South West, which is where I call home. I went to school there, my father was born in Penzance and we have family dating back to the 1600s in my local village.”

Ahead of Tuesday's talks, the committee chairman Sir Graham Brady met privately with Mrs May, when he is reported to have told her MPs want her to announce when she is going.

Under current party rules, MPs cannot mount a fresh leadership challenge until 12 months after last December's failed attempt.

However, amid growing frustration over the latest delays to Brexit, some MPs now want to the rules to be rewritten to allow another challenge as early as June.

One member of the executive, joint executive secretary Nigel Evans, has called publicly for Mrs May to go "as soon as possible”.

He said: “I believe the only way we're going to break this impasse properly is if we have fresh leadership of the Conservative Party. If there was an announcement today by the Prime Minister then of course we could start the process straight away.”

Mr Evans added: “I have never said this before. I did say to Theresa May 'Do not breathe fresh life into Nigel Farage', and that's exactly what she has done. He has gone from his death bed to the Olympics, because Brexit hasn't happened.”

However other members were reported to have pushed back at Tuesday's meeting, questioning what a fresh leadership contest at the current time would achieve.

Mrs May has already sought to buy time, promising Tory MPs last month that she would go once she has delivered Brexit.

But following the latest extension to the Article 50 withdrawal process there is growing impatience among her critics.

They fear the Tories will suffer heavy losses to Mr Farage's Brexit Party if - as now seems likely - the UK is forced to go ahead with voting in the European elections on May 23.

[Ssnake]

This may be helpful.

 

Well, reality once again proved stranger than fiction (because fiction has to make sense). Tried to keep tabs on it, but only with limited success:

 

 

 

 

One of the reasons I pay very little attention to what the pundits say. Everybody knows that the future cannot be known, yet everybody demands predictions.

Human nature can be hilarious.

[Stuart Galbraith]

There was a British minister, I forget who, whom during the Troubles famously said 'Anyone who thinks they understand Northern Ireland has been misinformed'. Such is also the case with Brexit.

[Harold Jones]

 

 

 

... If you pay tax, you should vote. ...

With that logic, even children — who pay VAT, state and/or local sales taxes on products — should arguably also be allowed to vote, even drink alcohol, drive cars ... be drafted.

 

 

You can join the military at 16. Bob Griffin, who used to post here as Commander, Joined the Junior Leaders when he was 16.

 

Of course they wont let you actually KILL anyone till you are 18. But if there is a national emergency.....

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/shortcuts/2013/apr/23/british-armed-forces-16-year-olds

 

Can they join on their own or do their parents have to sign off? I joined the army at 17 but my dad had to sign off on the paper work.

[TonyE]

 

But back to brexit. When is the next snap election?

 

 

Sweet Georgia Brown! Guess what.....i`ve got a fever...and the only prescription....is another snap election!

[Soren Ras]

needs more cowbell.

 

--

Soren

[BansheeOne]

Well, reality once again proved stranger than fiction (because fiction has to make sense). Tried to keep tabs on it, but only with limited success:

 

 

That beautiful. Can I steal it?

 

Here's the evolution of the flow charts at the original source BTW.

 

Meanwhile, Nicola Sturgeon aims for another referendum on Scottish independence.

 

Sturgeon: Brexit should trigger Scottish independence vote by 2021

Scotland’s first minister says ‘independent nations’ wield more power in EU than Scotland does within the UK.

 

By Charlie Cooper

4/24/19, 3:59 PM CET | Updated 4/24/19, 4:26 PM CET

 

Scotland should hold a referendum on independence before 2021 if the U.K. leaves the EU, First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said.

 

Announcing plans for legislation setting the rules of a second independence vote, Sturgeon told the Scottish Parliament that the Brexit process had revealed "the limits of Scotland's influence within the U.K." and strengthened the case for splitting from the union.

“A choice between Brexit and a future for Scotland as an independent European nation should be offered in the lifetime of this parliament," the Scottish National Party leader said. "If Scotland is taken out of the EU, a referendum within that timescale must be open to us. That would be our route to avoiding the worst of the damage that Brexit would do.”

 

The current Scottish Parliament term ends in May 2021.

 

Members of the Scottish Parliament (MSPs) would by the end of 2019 vote on legislation paving the way for a vote, Sturgeon said. But an imminent constitutional clash with Theresa May's Westminster government will be avoided as a transfer of powers — required to hold the referendum — would not be needed at this legislative stage.

 

May refused in 2017 to grant Sturgeon's previous application for a legally-binding independence vote, known as a Section 30 request, and the prime minister's spokesperson said this week that position had not changed.

 

In her statement, Sturgeon told members of the Scottish Parliament that she believed the U.K. position would "prove to be unsustainable" but that moving ahead with the preparatory legislation before a formal Section 30 request would avoid "a stand-off with a U.K. government that may soon be out office.”

 

The SNP-led government in Scotland stepped up calls for a second independence referendum within hours of the U.K. voting to leave the EU in June 2016. After an initial Section 30 request in March 2017 was rejected, Sturgeon put plans for a referendum on hold following the June 2017 U.K. general election, saying that the issue would be revived and the timetable set out when the Brexit outcome was clearer.

 

However, with the initial March 2019 date for the U.K.'s departure having come and gone, and doubt cast over the Brexit process by a string of delays — the latest potentially until October — Sturgeon said the time had come to "safeguard Scotland's interests."

 

The SNP backs a second referendum on EU membership and Sturgeon added that efforts to prevent Brexit altogether would continue. But if the U.K. does leave, she said that Scotland, which voted 62 percent in favor of Remain in the June 2016 referendum, must have the chance to break away and stay within the EU.

 

[...]

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/nicola-sturgeon-brexit-should-trigger-scottish-independence-vote-by-2021/

[TonyE]

needs more cowbell.

 

--

Soren

 

I live to serve:

 

[Ssnake]

That beautiful. Can I steal it?

 

Sure. My only contribution are the wiggly green lines. I will confess though, I tried to reflect the insanity with their drawing style.

[Chris Werb]

 

 

 

. I dont believe you are biologically wired to be a lefty at 16 and a Tory at 60. It just doesnt work like that.

That reminds me of the old saying, "A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged."

 

..and a liberal Libertarian is a conservative who has been arrested for having sex with a 14 year old girl..

 

FIFY.

 

 

FIFY

[Stuart Galbraith]

 

 

 

 

... If you pay tax, you should vote. ...

With that logic, even children — who pay VAT, state and/or local sales taxes on products — should arguably also be allowed to vote, even drink alcohol, drive cars ... be drafted.

 

 

You can join the military at 16. Bob Griffin, who used to post here as Commander, Joined the Junior Leaders when he was 16.

 

Of course they wont let you actually KILL anyone till you are 18. But if there is a national emergency.....

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/shortcuts/2013/apr/23/british-armed-forces-16-year-olds

 

Can they join on their own or do their parents have to sign off? I joined the army at 17 but my dad had to sign off on the paper work.

 

 

Thats a good question, I never thought to ask Bob that.

[Stuart Galbraith]

 

Well, reality once again proved stranger than fiction (because fiction has to make sense). Tried to keep tabs on it, but only with limited success:

 

 

That beautiful. Can I steal it?

 

Here's the evolution of the flow charts at the original source BTW.

 

Meanwhile, Nicola Sturgeon aims for another referendum on Scottish independence.

 

Sturgeon: Brexit should trigger Scottish independence vote by 2021

 

Scotland’s first minister says ‘independent nations’ wield more power in EU than Scotland does within the UK.

 

By Charlie Cooper

4/24/19, 3:59 PM CET | Updated 4/24/19, 4:26 PM CET

 

Scotland should hold a referendum on independence before 2021 if the U.K. leaves the EU, First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said.

 

Announcing plans for legislation setting the rules of a second independence vote, Sturgeon told the Scottish Parliament that the Brexit process had revealed "the limits of Scotland's influence within the U.K." and strengthened the case for splitting from the union.

“A choice between Brexit and a future for Scotland as an independent European nation should be offered in the lifetime of this parliament," the Scottish National Party leader said. "If Scotland is taken out of the EU, a referendum within that timescale must be open to us. That would be our route to avoiding the worst of the damage that Brexit would do.”

 

The current Scottish Parliament term ends in May 2021.

 

Members of the Scottish Parliament (MSPs) would by the end of 2019 vote on legislation paving the way for a vote, Sturgeon said. But an imminent constitutional clash with Theresa May's Westminster government will be avoided as a transfer of powers — required to hold the referendum — would not be needed at this legislative stage.

 

May refused in 2017 to grant Sturgeon's previous application for a legally-binding independence vote, known as a Section 30 request, and the prime minister's spokesperson said this week that position had not changed.

 

In her statement, Sturgeon told members of the Scottish Parliament that she believed the U.K. position would "prove to be unsustainable" but that moving ahead with the preparatory legislation before a formal Section 30 request would avoid "a stand-off with a U.K. government that may soon be out office.”

 

The SNP-led government in Scotland stepped up calls for a second independence referendum within hours of the U.K. voting to leave the EU in June 2016. After an initial Section 30 request in March 2017 was rejected, Sturgeon put plans for a referendum on hold following the June 2017 U.K. general election, saying that the issue would be revived and the timetable set out when the Brexit outcome was clearer.

 

However, with the initial March 2019 date for the U.K.'s departure having come and gone, and doubt cast over the Brexit process by a string of delays — the latest potentially until October — Sturgeon said the time had come to "safeguard Scotland's interests."

 

The SNP backs a second referendum on EU membership and Sturgeon added that efforts to prevent Brexit altogether would continue. But if the U.K. does leave, she said that Scotland, which voted 62 percent in favor of Remain in the June 2016 referendum, must have the chance to break away and stay within the EU.

 

[...]

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/nicola-sturgeon-brexit-should-trigger-scottish-independence-vote-by-2021/

 

 

 

The problem Nicola Sturgeon has is, the British Government has to agree to let her have a referendum. So here is the problem. The only people likely to give her a referendum are people who need her support. And if Scotland declares independence, it will bring down any Government the SNP is part of. SNP is actually a fairly minor bit player in Westminster politics anyway.

 

She can keep spamming 'I want a referendum' as many times as she wants. I predict from this point on that the next choice of referendum will be to go with the rapture or not.

[TonyE]

Salmon(d), Sturgeon.......there is something fishy about the scottish first ministers......

[Stuart Galbraith]

You know politics in the UK is in trouble, when the Scottish politicians are even more venal and self serving than the British ones.

 

I have to ask the question, would the EU really want them, when its had to face down all the trouble over the Northern Irish/Republic border? They would have to be nuts. You think British politicians are troublesome, these would be like fire ants in the bed.

[seahawk]

Well, they would want to be in the EU.