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Because The United Kingdom?


Mr King

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2 hours ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

Yeah, there was lots we were doing in the same period. Ive said many times before, we had real problems keeping British railways running, because we were exporting the most excellent Welsh coal to America to pay off our wartime loans, and importing what was essentially coal and wood briquettes which cause untold problems with locomotives designed to run on high calorific coal. We even briefly experimened on running locomotives on oil, which on an island largely made out of coal, really tells you how hard up we were (and briefly, how cheap oil was).

Re Landrover, the early ones were RAF cockpit green, because the ministry of supply had a shitton of that left over from all the Spitfires and Lancasters. But im sure you knew that.

My own view, I think we tripped in 1945, and we have yet to find our step since. Yes, the 1945 Government did contribute to that, a little. But ive yet to see one since get it right, with a convincing plan for the future. Wilson had it close when he talked about exploiting the 'White Heat of Technology'.  But he did nothing to establish it, because the Unions didnt allow it presumably, and he was a bit of a fucking idiot.. Thatcher did nothing other than taking the financial shackles off, and effectively built the PRC economy. Again, didnt enfranchise the country worth a damn as far as I can see.

Some American, It may have been kissinger Im not sure, said Britain lost and Empire, but has yet to find a role. Its still true.

Fark, Kissenger is our cross to bear, that fool should never have been allowed anywhere near government or any position of authority.  

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51 minutes ago, Murph said:

Fark, Kissenger is our cross to bear, that fool should never have been allowed anywhere near government or any position of authority.  

I have never been able to figure out how that guy got appointed Lord High Commissioner.

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3 hours ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

Anyone right of moderate right? :)

 

No, thats too broad a brush. As far as policies, I can only go by how I classify the Conservatives. There is a middle of the road, happy go lucky freebooting bunch that believe in free trade, maximum freedom of rights, low legistlation, low tax. They even liked being in Europe for the trade opportunities it brought. Whilst Ive issues with the low tax ( Because like nice roads, healthcare, well funded local councils and having a strong military so I dont get bombed in my bed), I respect all those positions. I dont necessarily agree how they are done, but as a basic concept, they really arent that far away from the Liberals or the Labour middle ground, who all essentiall believe, to lesser or more extents, in many of the same things.

In the Conservatives, the 'far right' are by myself classified as an increased willingness to bring out authoritarian legislation. This was strongly in evidence in the aftermath of the terrorist attacks in the UK, and it involves such things as increased surveillance of online activity, and email hacking and phone surveillance. I dont necessarily think being concerned about immigration makes you hard right, but the way they do it (keeping them in places that are effectively prisons, reducing staffing for processing so they are kept hanging around forever, painting over waiting rooms modified for children with grey paint to make them less welcoming, the Rwanda plan, the Empire Windrush repatriations, etc etc) generally does show an intolerance for anyone that doesnt have white skin and WASP perspectives. They also show a distinct lack of interest in the poorer elements of our society. At least the moderate conservatives believe you can only lift people out of poverty by giving them a job, and I agree. The far right ones dont really care, as long as their precious financial insitituions are preserved. And I believe that had an awful lot to do with Brexit, or at least the right wings fixation over it. The immigration was just a ruse to sell it to the public.

Thats my classification anyway, fwiw. Im sure other people have their own perspectives on such things whom are willing to tell me im completely wrong.

If you look at it objectively, there is such a wide split in the Conservatives that I think there is a genuine prospect of splitting into two different parties. The gap between both wings has grown so wide, its making them ungovernable. John Major found this as long ago as the 1990's, and arguably its gotten worse since then.

Increasing surveillance? I don't think it's rightist at all, not necessarily leftist either, just... common enough all along the political spectrum, with few exceptions.

Anti third-world immigration? Damn, I share the sentiment to a point where your alleged 'hard right' looks like Mother Theresa*, I must also say it looks like they were doing a shit job, given how many migrants UK has allowed in recent years. Maybe they deserve the points for at least trying to appear unwelcome? Nah, only results matter.

As far as the 'culture war' is concerned your Tories are absolute pussies, waving rainbow flags and not challenging the 'progressive' narrative at all. It was under their watch when the police was arresting people for twatter posts and 'hate speech', while the taxpayer was financing 'transitions' for the mentally ill men claiming they're actually women.  

I don't even consider them right wing by my standards. Our departing miserable cunts were at least waging this culture war and challenged the leftist narrative. They really sucked in being anti third-world immigration too, but at least they built a wall, opposed the migrant relocation mechanism and portrayed Poland in a positive (to me) light. Doesn't change the fact that they gave some 200k work visas to non-Europeans, some of them actual third worlders (Africa and Middle East) and for that they can rot in hell as far as I'm concerned.

So to me it looks like of the two alleged rightist traits one is not rightist at all and while the second kinda is, they absolutely sucked in putting it to practice.

*e.g. I have zero issue with them dying in Belarusian forests during the winter behind our wall and I rejoice every time Poland is internationally portrayed as anti-migrant, racist etc., as it decreases the chance of others trying to use that route. 

 

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2 hours ago, JWB said:

I have never been able to figure out how that guy got appointed Lord High Commissioner.

He styled himself an expert on Nuclear strategy, wrote a book about it, hung around Nelson Rockerfeller, and got noticed by Nixon.

To be fair to him, he claims to have figured out Vietnam was a bust by 1965, which was far earlier than anyone else figured out. On the other hand, most of the policies he was eulogied for look uncomfortably like appeasement with 50 year hindsight.

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2 hours ago, urbanoid said:

Increasing surveillance? I don't think it's rightist at all, not necessarily leftist either, just... common enough all along the political spectrum, with few exceptions.

Anti third-world immigration? Damn, I share the sentiment to a point where your alleged 'hard right' looks like Mother Theresa*, I must also say it looks like they were doing a shit job, given how many migrants UK has allowed in recent years. Maybe they deserve the points for at least trying to appear unwelcome? Nah, only results matter.

As far as the 'culture war' is concerned your Tories are absolute pussies, waving rainbow flags and not challenging the 'progressive' narrative at all. It was under their watch when the police was arresting people for twatter posts and 'hate speech', while the taxpayer was financing 'transitions' for the mentally ill men claiming they're actually women.  

I don't even consider them right wing by my standards. Our departing miserable cunts were at least waging this culture war and challenged the leftist narrative. They really sucked in being anti third-world immigration too, but at least they built a wall, opposed the migrant relocation mechanism and portrayed Poland in a positive (to me) light. Doesn't change the fact that they gave some 200k work visas to non-Europeans, some of them actual third worlders (Africa and Middle East) and for that they can rot in hell as far as I'm concerned.

So to me it looks like of the two alleged rightist traits one is not rightist at all and while the second kinda is, they absolutely sucked in putting it to practice.

*e.g. I have zero issue with them dying in Belarusian forests during the winter behind our wall and I rejoice every time Poland is internationally portrayed as anti-migrant, racist etc., as it decreases the chance of others trying to use that route. 

 

Yes, but you are a different country. The political middle ground was, and remains, in a different place than your country.

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2 hours ago, Murph said:

Stuart: Milk first or Tea?

That rather strikes me as asking 'Ground first, or Parachute?' :D

Sugar first, then bag, then hot water (poured on the bag, which is summarily beaten into submission 10 times with spoon), add milk ( for me just enough to make it change colour), then stir, et voila, nectar of the gods in a cup.

Oh, I should say, make it Yorkshire tea. Imho It tastes the best, and we have to sustain those Yorkshire tea plantations somehow.

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Nothing worse than a bunch of monocled, plus-fours-wearing tea snobs arguing about proper tea and the dcline of the Empire. 

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10 hours ago, Murph said:

Sugar first?!  In my experience that makes a less strong brew, I always add sugar (only to hot tea) afterwards.  Then lemon.  

Depends on whether you want a sugar hit. For me it tends to overwhelm the taste of the tea, and of course it makes it more likely you forget to put it in. But its less important than the tea before the milk imho.

4 hours ago, Ivanhoe said:

Nothing worse than a bunch of monocled, plus-fours-wearing tea snobs arguing about proper tea and the dcline of the Empire. 

At least we never thought the right way to make a cuppa was to mix it with saltwater. :P

Edited by Stuart Galbraith
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On 11/26/2023 at 9:09 AM, urbanoid said:

Can you list some characteristics that would make them 'hard right'? 

Because Stuart disagrees with their policies, naturally.

In much the same way as anything that isn't tinged with communist pink is "hard right" in every right-thinking media outlet's mind.

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Back to the tea topic; per the wife, for those who drink iced tea the proper sequence is: ice, sugar, "flavoring(I have shown the correct spelling) which for her at this time is either butterscotch or caramel, then the tea.

I admit the first time I saw her do this, I started to experience mild vertigo and nausea and had to sit down when the blurry vision started.

Edited by Rick
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22 minutes ago, DB said:

Because Stuart disagrees with their policies, naturally.

In much the same way as anything that isn't tinged with communist pink is "hard right" in every right-thinking media outlet's mind.

Or the  way that  not agreeing with putting everyone whose family hasnt been here since William the Conqueror back on the boats is classed as outright Communism, in every right wing media forum.  Of which we have not a few in the UK. These are the same media outlets that were extolling the virtues of Priti Patel, Suella Braverman and Liz Truss, which should probably tell you something.

16 minutes ago, Rick said:

Back to the tea topic; per the wife, for those who drink iced tea the proper sequence is: ice, sugar, "flavoring(I have shown the correct spelling) which for her at this time is either butterscotch or caramel, then the tea.

I admit the first time I saw her do this, I started to experience mild vertigo and nausea and had to sit down when the blurry vision started.

As far as Im concerned, the only people who had the perfect right to drink iced tea were the Franklin expedition and Scott of the Antarctic, and we all remember what happened to them.

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2 hours ago, Rick said:

Back to the tea topic; per the wife, for those who drink iced tea the proper sequence is: ice, sugar, "flavoring...

Chemist here... :)

Sugar solubility in water varies drastically depending on temperature of water (hotter it is easier it is to dissolve) , so that leads to more need to stir it and more time for it to dissolve. And nothing changes in taste if you add sugar before or after ice, so sugar first, dissolve, add ice, wait for it to cool, add flavoring (adding flavoring to a hot one might change some flavors).

Alternatively for sweetener, you can make sugar/honey syrup, 1kg sugar, 1/2kg honey, 1l (1kg) of water (1:0.5:1 mix per mass if using other sizes, but sugar comes in 1kg packages here, so I make it in that sized batches), 1g of citric acid (if making small batch just a small pinch), heat slowly and mix until all dissolves, then wait for it to start boiling. When gently boiling remove as much foam as possible (that is "junk" from the honey and sugar). At some moment mix should change pretty rapidly from cloudy to clear, and depending on honey used  it can be any color from light yellow to almost dark brown, but it should be clear. You will get about 1.5l of mix. Let it cool to a room temperature then pour in the bottle and keep in fridge or other dark and cool place*. Tastes way better when used in mixed drinks than pure sugar. It is great for all drinks requiring sweetener, from lemonade to cocktails.

*If you keep it non-refrigerated oscillations in temperature might in some rare cases induce it to crystalize. Which is just inconvenient if you are using plastic bottle for storage, but it is major PITA with glass bottle. Ask me how I know. :)

Edited by bojan
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Crystallisation like that happens with honey, too. You can reconvert it in the microwave, using low power and/or short bursts. You're not trying to boil it, just persuade it back into the better state.

When Rick says his wife adds the tea last, does that mean a teabag into iced water, or hot tea (um, solution/tisane/tincture/whatever?) added to the hot water?

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Oh yeah, one more thing about "Thatcher, Thatcher, milk snatcher" - for about half the year the milk was soured because it was delivered at 5am and left in the sun until the caretaker took it inside. It was never refrigerated in our school.

For a significant portion of the rest of the year, it had frozen and blown the foil cap off the bottle and the top crate would have been vandalised by birds going after the cream.

(Our milk was pasteurised only, not homogenised, so the cream layer would separate in all whole milk.)

And most kids had to be forced to drink it.

It was a wartime rationing legacy and not needed by the 1970s.

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