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Posted

Given that 1 in 6 people in the UK are old age pensioners it's certainly telling.

Posted

Its completely indefensible. If you are going to tear down posters, you can tear down Palestinian flags, or you can allow both sides the right to expression. Which to be honest, would be my prefered response.

I suspect its a case of the police knowing our Jews arent a problem as far as rioting is concerned, and some of the Muslim groups are, so they take the easy route and suppress the Jews right to expression instead. Good old met, falling back on its historical experience from Mosleys marches.

Posted

There's two things going on in the COVID hearings, and it should be made clear that these add context.

Firstly, Boris asking whether it's worth destroying the economy for people who are going to die anyway - the context for this is that the pandemic wasn't a pandemic at the time, it was an emerging epidemic candidate. Transmission method and overall lethality were not known, there was no diagnostic test and no vaccine. It's well within the remit of the Prime Minister to ask the brutal questions. Compare this with the actual business of being the first responder at a catastrophic accident scene - how do you triage the casualties?

Secondly, the people like Dominic Cummings should be considered in the same way that you should look at those who have pleaded guilty in return for low to zero punishment in the Trump-related cases - they're looking after their own interests and they always have only a very minor interest in any form of absolute truth if it places them in an awkward position.

Quite why someone who was extremely critical of Dominic Cummings' behaviour during lockdown (see the Barnard Castle story for details) is now lapping up his accounts as gospel truth says more about that person's agenda with respect to BoJo in particular and the Tories in general than anything else.

Outside of the agendas in place (and bearing in mind that I probably have one, too), my opinion is that the only people who seem to find it surprising that there was an element of chaos in the COVID response are feigning it. Even if you had, as a government, defined plans for a generic response to what you thought was an existential threat, it's unlikely to match what you're actually faced with and so there will be turbulence.

Deliberate disinformation out of China prolonged this chaotic period, by failing to help characterise the actual threat, and disinformation was used by them and others to prolong the detriment to societies that should otherwise have been able to manage the situation better.

None of the above should be considered to be a desire to start an argument over the various theories and claims floating around in the COVID topic, I'm just not interested in engaging with those either way.

Posted

Watching Helen MacNamara discussing Cummings, and yes, he clearly was part of the problem, despite his undoubted competence in some areas.

There is of course, also this.

However one looks at it, No10 was malfunctioning, very badly, and that clearly had consequences  on how COVID was handled.

Posted

Arrest, jail, censure, probably have lots to lose. 

Posted

Ok, so lets get a few things straight here, because I think people are conflating several things and constructing mountains again, as per Tanknet SOP.

People have a right in Britain to protest for the Palestinian cause. I dont personally like it, I dont share it, I think they way they do it is utterly clueless at this particular moment. But seeing as we are a western, liberal democracy, they have a perfect right to do it, and I wouldnt want to see that surpressed.

What I DO NOT understand, is why the Police complain when Israeli flags are flown, or posters of Hamas hostages torn down, but by and large you can get away with saying 'from the river to the sea, all palestine will be free'. Which is an explicit statement of the destruction of the state of Israel that ive seen. And if you are a palestinian supporter, you can fly a flag damn near anywhere apparently.

No, not all protesters believe that Israel should be destroyed. For my part I would be more satisfied if I saw signs saying 'stop the bombing, release the hostages', rather than the apparent belief both events are disconnected. Regardless, most, other than some diehards, dont want Israel destroyed. Although my own personal opinion, I suspect if it ever was, they wouldnt turn out in droves to protest against it.

Yes, as always the police have a thankless task, if they go hard, they damage civil liberties. If they go soft, they are seen as pro palestinian. They have my sympathy for a difficult job. And yet, thus far, they seem to be genuinely pissing off Israel supporters. And as far as having protesters camped all around the Cenotaph, something I was always raised to believe was sacrosanct, then they are showing infinite cluelessness that probably ought to be punished by someone being fired. 'Not our responsiblity' they say. Well, take responsiblity and deal with it you clueless fucks, and stop defering to someone else.

Ok, so they did arrest some people with pictures of Hamas paragliders, and some people shouting hate speech (from the river etc etc) were arrested. But enough to make an impression on the rest to continue remain peaceful and respectful to the rule of law? Not even close I suspect.

Here is the thing, there are good police and there are indifferent police, and there are exceptionally crap police. The MET once again shows its inablity to think its way out of a paper bag, and make the country look a laughing stock on the world stage. Dont mistake that incompetence for the country as a whole.

Even the Home Secretary, whom has long been a stranger to competence herself is disgusted, and for once she has a right to be. Althought one might say she and her predecessor have much of the responsiblity for the incapable ineffectual mob the MET seem to have turned into.

 

 

 

5 hours ago, Ivanhoe said:

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Who would want it? There is no tea.

Posted

The police behaves that way because they were told by the Sir Humphreys in police apparatus to behave that way, they also know very well they would not be condemned by TV and most journalists by their pro-Hamas behaviour. 

Posted (edited)

No, it doesnt work that way. You dont have the Home office breathing down the neck of the police telling them every day what to do. Like the military, quite clearly most, if not all, of the decisionmaking is made by the senior Officers themselves, just as it is in America.

If they are making bad decisions, and they are, then that points to poor leadership, something that has handicapped the MET for years. So much so, I would suggest there is a case for breaking it up.

As far as the Cenotaph decision, I understand it was not up to the Police to give approval, it was up to the local council to give permission. Although one might think in a perfect world, they would have talked it over with the police, or had discusisons with the Home Office before giving permission. But like I say, poor leadership isnt just a problem in the Police. Its endemic in multiple levels of British society.

You are interpreting this as a conspiracy to enfranchise the Palestinians. Its not, its senior Police and undoubtedly local Government not wanting to rock the boat. Which is bad enough to be sure.

And its NOT just a British problem. Ive just watched a protest in the US (Washington I think) and what did I notice on the signs? 'From the River to the sea'....

As for the TV, there are more channels than just the BBC here.

Edited by Stuart Galbraith
Posted
1 hour ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

No, it doesnt work that way. You dont have the Home office breathing down the neck of the police telling them every day what to do. Like the military, quite clearly most, if not all, of the decisionmaking is made by the senior Officers themselves, just as it is in America.

 

In America, the FOGOs are usually butt-buddies with Congressional lifers (that's how they got the Congressional seal of approval on their promotion to their first star). And Congressional lifers are butt-buddies with well-heeled lobbyists. 

The current trans-friendly/ciswhitemale-unfriendly DoD leadership here can be relied on to make woke-friendly decisions, because they were chosen specifically for their value system.

 

 

Posted
1 hour ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

If they are making bad decisions, and they are, then that points to poor leadership, something that has handicapped the MET for years. So much so, I would suggest there is a case for breaking it up.

As far as the Cenotaph decision, I understand it was not up to the Police to give approval, it was up to the local council to give permission. Although one might think in a perfect world, they would have talked it over with the police, or had discusisons with the Home Office before giving permission. But like I say, poor leadership isnt just a problem in the Police. Its endemic in multiple levels of western society.

FIFY.

It seems clear to me that, when bad decisions are made in these times, instead of viewing the decision at a micro scale, it should be viewed at a macro scale. For example, "Why does organization X, when it makes bad decisions, always goes against Judeo-Christian values and the tenets of western civilization?"

X can be The Plot, universities, public educators, the US Army, whatever. 

 

Posted
2 hours ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

No, it doesnt work that way. You dont have the Home office breathing down the neck of the police telling them every day what to do. Like the military, quite clearly most, if not all, of the decisionmaking is made by the senior Officers themselves, just as it is in America.

If they are making bad decisions, and they are, then that points to poor leadership, something that has handicapped the MET for years. So much so, I would suggest there is a case for breaking it up.

As far as the Cenotaph decision, I understand it was not up to the Police to give approval, it was up to the local council to give permission. Although one might think in a perfect world, they would have talked it over with the police, or had discusisons with the Home Office before giving permission. But like I say, poor leadership isnt just a problem in the Police. Its endemic in multiple levels of British society.

You are interpreting this as a conspiracy to enfranchise the Palestinians. Its not, its senior Police and undoubtedly local Government not wanting to rock the boat. Which is bad enough to be sure.

And its NOT just a British problem. Ive just watched a protest in the US (Washington I think) and what did I notice on the signs? 'From the River to the sea'....

As for the TV, there are more channels than just the BBC here.

I am talking structurally, Home Office is where are the bureaucrats that define what police priorities should, what should be taught, who and what crime should be discriminated and whom can make that crime without punishment or just a slap in writs.

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