Kiev Is Burning

[Yama]

55 minutes ago, seahawk said:

This is a quote out of context. The quote has to be understood as meaning that Poles (catholic) would never become citizens of the German Reich (protestant). Therefore they were considered foes of the empire (Reichsfeinde).  But they were not alone, Bismarck considered political Catholicism, the Danish minority,  the French minority, the labour movement and others as foes of the empire.

...great?

Seems to me if you don't want some people as citizens of your empire, maybe not annex their lands then? Or am I nuts?

[glenn239]

14 hours ago, Yama said:

Maybe that was not the brightest spot in history of Poland, but really it would be absurd to argue it would have mattered to Nazis at all had Poland stayed out of it. Hitler (and not just him, but many Germans) saw Polish state an anathema which should not be allowed to exist.

Stuart is constantly going on about Chamberlain's role at Munich in 1938.  But what if Poland in 1938 had accepted the Soviet proposal of an alliance to the purpose of supporting the Czechs against the Germans?  

[seahawk]

Considering that the elections of 1881 the foes of the empire gained about 2/3 of the seats in parliament, I would not make more of Bismarck`s opinion than it was - the opinion of an old Prussian leader.

[glenn239]

8 hours ago, Roman Alymov said:

   I think it is not correct to say that "in 1938 Poland sided with Hitler". I would rather put it another way: in this years, Germany led by "collective Hitler" and Poland led by "collective  Piłsudski"*  were practicing simmilar political lines and this lines were not so different from best practicies by other imperialist powers. 

Had Poland sided with Prague, then Poland would have mobilized its army at Germany in unison with the Czechs and approved a Soviet expeditionary force of some ratio to Polish troops - say 1:3 or something like that.  Poland would have pressed in Paris and London for similar measures.  Did Warsaw do that?  No, they went after the Slovaks.  They sided with Hitler.

[sunday]

1 minute ago, glenn239 said:

Had Poland sided with Prague, then Poland would have mobilized its army at Germany in unison with the Czechs and approved a Soviet expeditionary force of some ratio to Polish troops - say 1:3 or something like that.  Poland would have pressed in Paris and London for similar measures.  Did Warsaw do that?  No, they went after the Slovaks.  They sided with Hitler.

In 1938 Stalin atrocities were known. Hitler's less so.

[Roman Alymov]

2 minutes ago, glenn239 said:

Stuart is constantly going on about Chamberlain's role at Munich in 1938.  But what if Poland in 1938 had accepted the Soviet proposal of an alliance to the purpose of supporting the Czechs against the Germans?  

   It was obviously impossible for Pilsudsky's Poland to accept any alliance with USSR, that was both their old enemy Russia and new enemy Communists. What happened in 1939 was actually rooted back in 1919 if not earlier - may be as far away as XVII when Poland became the only place where nobiles have prevailed over central power.....

[Roman Alymov]

4 minutes ago, glenn239 said:

Had Poland sided with Prague, then Poland would have mobilized its army at Germany in unison with the Czechs and approved a Soviet expeditionary force of some ratio to Polish troops - say 1:3 or something like that.  Poland would have pressed in Paris and London for similar measures.  Did Warsaw do that?  No, they went after the Slovaks.  They sided with Hitler.

Again, Poland have started acting this way long before Hitler became any political figure (see the story of how Vilnus became Vilno). And nobody paid attention. 

[glenn239]

15 minutes ago, Yama said:

...great?

Seems to me if you don't want some people as citizens of your empire, maybe not annex their lands then? Or am I nuts?

Dunno.  Ask the Israelis.

[glenn239]

7 minutes ago, sunday said:

In 1938 Stalin atrocities were known. Hitler's less so.

The question stands.  Had the Poles accepted the Soviet proposal for an expeditionary force and mobilized in unison with the Czechs at Germany, what happens?

[urbanoid]

1 minute ago, glenn239 said:

The question stands.  Had the Poles accepted the Soviet proposal for an expeditionary force and mobilized in unison with the Czechs at Germany, what happens?

A 'spontaneous' communist revolution starts in Poland. Possibly the revolutionary 'government' issues a petition to become a Soviet republic.

[RETAC21]

3 hours ago, sunday said:

Interesting. Did not recall that, but considering Bismarck politics and policies, it makes sense.

So, the known Poland's struggle to survive between two empires becomes even more commendable.

Reichsfende: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichsfeinde it took a more sinister meaning with the Nazis. Bismarck pretty much wanted a WASP Germany.

[urbanoid]

32 minutes ago, glenn239 said:

Had Poland sided with Prague, then Poland would have mobilized its army at Germany in unison with the Czechs and approved a Soviet expeditionary force of some ratio to Polish troops - say 1:3 or something like that.  Poland would have pressed in Paris and London for similar measures.  Did Warsaw do that?  No, they went after the Slovaks.  They sided with Hitler.

Did Czechoslovakia 'side with the Soviet Union' by taking the same area from Poland in 1920?

[Roman Alymov]

6 minutes ago, urbanoid said:

A 'spontaneous' communist revolution starts in Poland. Possibly the revolutionary 'government' issues a petition to become a Soviet republic.

No need for USSR for this, socialist/communist elements have remained in Poland by the end of 1930th (not surprising since  their heavy presence in RusEmpire time  -and Poland was not exactly worker's paradise)

From Коммунистическая партия Польши — Википедия

The Communist Party of Poland, KPP (gender. Komunistyczna Partia Polski, KPP) was a revolutionary communist party that operated in Poland in 1918-1938, until 1925 it was called the Communist Workers' Party of Poland, KPP (gender. Komunistyczna Partia Robotnicza Polski, KPRP).

History
Foundation
The KRPP was founded on December 16, 1918 as a result of the unification of the Social Democracy of the Kingdom of Poland and Lithuania (SDKPiL) and the Polish Socialist Party - Levica (PPP—Levica). In March 1919, the representative of the KRPP, Joseph Unschlicht, participated in the founding congress of the Communist International, and in July the party officially joined the Comintern. In 1919, the KRPP participated in the parliamentary elections, winning 2 seats in the Sejm.

In 1919-1920, fragments of large Jewish organizations joined the party: the Polish Bund, Poalei Zion and Vereinigte ("Unification"), as well as the Belarusian Socialist Party and the Ukrainian Social Democratic Workers' Party. In 1920, the left wing of the Polish Socialist Party (PPP) joined the KRPP. Representatives of other leftist and socialist organizations in Poland constantly joined the party[1].

For supporting the RSFSR in the Soviet-Polish War of 1919-1921, the KPP was banned and operated illegally. The Communist Party opposed Poland's occupation of Western Ukraine and Western Belarus[2]. After the start of the Red Army's counteroffensive on June 30, 1920, the Provisional Revolutionary Committee of Poland (Polrevkom) was formed in Bialystok from members of the Communist Party of the Russian Federation and the Polish Bureau of the Central Committee of the RCP(b). It consists of: Julian Marhlevsky (Chairman), Felix Dzerzhinsky, Edward Prukhnyak, Joseph Unschlicht, Felix Kohn, Bernard Sachs, Stanislav Bobinsky, Tadeusz Rydwansky. The body functioned in the territories that were under the control of the Red Army, and carried out the nationalization of industry, confiscation of large land property and other measures on them[2].

The democratic period
In the relatively democratic period of 1921-1926, the party continued to operate illegally. By 1923, it had 5,000 members in its ranks[3]. The party had influence among trade unions and, under the name of the Union of Urban and Rural Proletariat (Związek Proletariatu Miast i Wsi), participated in the 1922 elections, as a result of which it received the support of 130,000 voters and 2 deputy seats in the Sejm.

The Second Congress of the Communist Party, held in Moscow in September—October 1923, revised the attitude towards peasant, land and national issues. There is a revision of positions related to the theoretical legacy of Rosa Luxemburg, which seriously determined the political line of the party. This legacy was characterized by three main points: the rejection of Lenin's slogan of "national self-determination"; the rejection of Lenin's tactical slogan "land to the peasants"; the rejection of the dictatorship of the proletariat as a means of terror. First of all, the issue of national self-determination was important for the Polish Communist Party. Even after the signing of the Riga Peace Treaty of 1921, it did not agree to recognize the independent Polish Republic and its borders, approved according to this treaty[1].

In 1923, the Communist Party of Western Belarus and the Communist Party of Western Ukraine joined the KRPP as autonomous organizations. At the congress, Adolf Varsky, Henryk Valetsky and Vera Kostsheva were elected to the Politburo of the Central Committee of the KRPP.

Within the party, there were different opinions not only about Trotsky's opposition, but also about Brandler's opposition within the Communist Party of Germany. In December 1923, the Politburo of the Communist Party of the Russian Federation sent a letter to the Central Committee of the CPSU(b) in defense of Trotsky. The letter, in particular, stated:

"... for our party, for the entire International, for the entire world revolutionary proletariat, the name of Comrade Trotsky is inextricably linked with the victorious October Revolution, with the Red Army, with communism and the world revolution"[1].

At the beginning of 1925, the third congress of the KPP was held in Minsk under the slogan of "Bolshevization of the party". A supporter of Stalin, Julian Lensky (Leshchinsky), began to advance to the first place in the party. At the congress, the party was renamed the Communist Party of Poland.

"Rehabilitation"
In May 1926, in a situation of economic crisis and rising unemployment, Jozef Pilsudski carried out a coup d'etat. The leadership of the Communist Party, led by Varsky, supported the coup, considering it a path to a "revolutionary democratic dictatorship"[4]. In Warsaw, members of the party participated in street clashes with supporters of the Vincent Vitos government, which they considered fascist. On May 13, together with the Polish Socialist Party, they organized a general strike. However, the Comintern soon recognized the actions of the leadership of the Polish Communist Party as erroneous.

The discussion of the "May mistake" and the coup of 1926 itself took place at the fourth congress of the KPP, which was held in May —August 1927 in Moscow. There was a split into a majority ("right") and a minority ("left"). Lensky's supporters (the "left faction") claimed that the coup was fascist, while the "right" — Varsky, Kostsheva and others — considered it the beginning of a military dictatorship with tendencies towards fascism. The struggle between the two factions lasted until the end of the 1920s.

In the 1920s and 1930s, the KPP agitated workers and peasants to fight against the "rehabilitation regime", organized numerous strikes and military actions (general strikes of the Lodz textile workers in 1928, 1933, 1936 and other years)[5]. Despite pressure and repression, the Communist Party managed to maintain its representation in the Sejm until the 1935 elections[6].

In the 1930s, the KPP had about 20,000 members. Many Communists were imprisoned: 3,775 people were arrested in 1930, 3,507 in 1931, and 6,982 in 1932. At the initiative of the Communist Party, a wide network of legal left-wing newspapers (over 300 titles) was created in Poland. The central organ of the party was the illegal newspaper Czerwony Sztandar ("Red Banner") and the magazine Nowy Przegląd ("New Review")[5]

The Spanish Civil War
The members of the party took part in the Spanish Civil War. The Polish Communists fought as part of the Dombrowski inter-brigade.

The Comintern Line
The end of the 1920s - the beginning of the 1930s is marked by the so—called "third period" of the Comintern[7]. In the context of this tactic, the fifth congress of the Polish Communist Party was held in 1930, at which the PPP was characterized as a fascist party and the imminent onset of the revolution was announced. However, by the mid-1930s, the tactics had changed. In 1935-1937, according to the decisions of the Seventh Congress of the Comintern, the KPP advocated the unification of the actions of communists, socialists and other forces in the common struggle against fascism[5].

The factional struggle in the party began to fade in 1928-1933. The leaders of the "right" were ousted from leadership positions. In 1929, Julian Lensky became the general secretary of the Communist Party. By the end of the 1930s, the repressions were already affecting Lensky and his supporters. In the Soviet Union, leading figures of the KPP were shot: Adolf Varsky, Joseph Unschlicht, Edward Pruchnyak, Vera Kostsheva, Henryk Valetsky, Julian Lensky and many other Polish communists, such as the writer Bruno Jasensky. Together with the CHECKPOINT, its components were defeated: the Communist Party of Western Ukraine and the Communist Party of Western Belarus.

On August 16, 1938, the Executive Committee of the Comintern declared the Polish Communist Party "saboteur" and voted for its dissolution[8]. After the dissolution, Polish Communists continued to operate in trade unions and other public organizations. In January 1942, former members of the KPP led by Marcel Novotko, Pavel Finder, Malgorzata Fornalska, Boleslav Moloec and others initiated the creation of the Polish Workers' Party. In 1956, the CPSU, the Communist Party of Italy, the Communist Party of Bulgaria, the Communist Party of Finland and the Polish United Workers' Party in a joint statement recognized the dissolution of the KPP in 1938 as unjustified[5].

 

[Roman Alymov]

1 minute ago, urbanoid said:

Did Czechoslovakia 'side with the Soviet Union' by taking the same area from Poland in 1920?

No, as Soviet Union was only founded in 1922, two years later  In 1920, there was still Civil War in Russia....

[urbanoid]

1 minute ago, Roman Alymov said:

No need for USSR for this, socialist/communist elements have remained in Poland by the end of 1930th (not surprising since  their heavy presence in RusEmpire time  -and Poland was not exactly worker's paradise)

From Коммунистическая партия Польши — Википедия

The Communist Party of Poland, KPP (gender. Komunistyczna Partia Polski, KPP) was a revolutionary communist party that operated in Poland in 1918-1938, until 1925 it was called the Communist Workers' Party of Poland, KPP (gender. Komunistyczna Partia Robotnicza Polski, KPRP).

History
Foundation
The KRPP was founded on December 16, 1918 as a result of the unification of the Social Democracy of the Kingdom of Poland and Lithuania (SDKPiL) and the Polish Socialist Party - Levica (PPP—Levica). In March 1919, the representative of the KRPP, Joseph Unschlicht, participated in the founding congress of the Communist International, and in July the party officially joined the Comintern. In 1919, the KRPP participated in the parliamentary elections, winning 2 seats in the Sejm.

In 1919-1920, fragments of large Jewish organizations joined the party: the Polish Bund, Poalei Zion and Vereinigte ("Unification"), as well as the Belarusian Socialist Party and the Ukrainian Social Democratic Workers' Party. In 1920, the left wing of the Polish Socialist Party (PPP) joined the KRPP. Representatives of other leftist and socialist organizations in Poland constantly joined the party[1].

For supporting the RSFSR in the Soviet-Polish War of 1919-1921, the KPP was banned and operated illegally. The Communist Party opposed Poland's occupation of Western Ukraine and Western Belarus[2]. After the start of the Red Army's counteroffensive on June 30, 1920, the Provisional Revolutionary Committee of Poland (Polrevkom) was formed in Bialystok from members of the Communist Party of the Russian Federation and the Polish Bureau of the Central Committee of the RCP(b). It consists of: Julian Marhlevsky (Chairman), Felix Dzerzhinsky, Edward Prukhnyak, Joseph Unschlicht, Felix Kohn, Bernard Sachs, Stanislav Bobinsky, Tadeusz Rydwansky. The body functioned in the territories that were under the control of the Red Army, and carried out the nationalization of industry, confiscation of large land property and other measures on them[2].

The democratic period
In the relatively democratic period of 1921-1926, the party continued to operate illegally. By 1923, it had 5,000 members in its ranks[3]. The party had influence among trade unions and, under the name of the Union of Urban and Rural Proletariat (Związek Proletariatu Miast i Wsi), participated in the 1922 elections, as a result of which it received the support of 130,000 voters and 2 deputy seats in the Sejm.

The Second Congress of the Communist Party, held in Moscow in September—October 1923, revised the attitude towards peasant, land and national issues. There is a revision of positions related to the theoretical legacy of Rosa Luxemburg, which seriously determined the political line of the party. This legacy was characterized by three main points: the rejection of Lenin's slogan of "national self-determination"; the rejection of Lenin's tactical slogan "land to the peasants"; the rejection of the dictatorship of the proletariat as a means of terror. First of all, the issue of national self-determination was important for the Polish Communist Party. Even after the signing of the Riga Peace Treaty of 1921, it did not agree to recognize the independent Polish Republic and its borders, approved according to this treaty[1].

In 1923, the Communist Party of Western Belarus and the Communist Party of Western Ukraine joined the KRPP as autonomous organizations. At the congress, Adolf Varsky, Henryk Valetsky and Vera Kostsheva were elected to the Politburo of the Central Committee of the KRPP.

Within the party, there were different opinions not only about Trotsky's opposition, but also about Brandler's opposition within the Communist Party of Germany. In December 1923, the Politburo of the Communist Party of the Russian Federation sent a letter to the Central Committee of the CPSU(b) in defense of Trotsky. The letter, in particular, stated:

"... for our party, for the entire International, for the entire world revolutionary proletariat, the name of Comrade Trotsky is inextricably linked with the victorious October Revolution, with the Red Army, with communism and the world revolution"[1].

At the beginning of 1925, the third congress of the KPP was held in Minsk under the slogan of "Bolshevization of the party". A supporter of Stalin, Julian Lensky (Leshchinsky), began to advance to the first place in the party. At the congress, the party was renamed the Communist Party of Poland.

"Rehabilitation"
In May 1926, in a situation of economic crisis and rising unemployment, Jozef Pilsudski carried out a coup d'etat. The leadership of the Communist Party, led by Varsky, supported the coup, considering it a path to a "revolutionary democratic dictatorship"[4]. In Warsaw, members of the party participated in street clashes with supporters of the Vincent Vitos government, which they considered fascist. On May 13, together with the Polish Socialist Party, they organized a general strike. However, the Comintern soon recognized the actions of the leadership of the Polish Communist Party as erroneous.

The discussion of the "May mistake" and the coup of 1926 itself took place at the fourth congress of the KPP, which was held in May —August 1927 in Moscow. There was a split into a majority ("right") and a minority ("left"). Lensky's supporters (the "left faction") claimed that the coup was fascist, while the "right" — Varsky, Kostsheva and others — considered it the beginning of a military dictatorship with tendencies towards fascism. The struggle between the two factions lasted until the end of the 1920s.

In the 1920s and 1930s, the KPP agitated workers and peasants to fight against the "rehabilitation regime", organized numerous strikes and military actions (general strikes of the Lodz textile workers in 1928, 1933, 1936 and other years)[5]. Despite pressure and repression, the Communist Party managed to maintain its representation in the Sejm until the 1935 elections[6].

In the 1930s, the KPP had about 20,000 members. Many Communists were imprisoned: 3,775 people were arrested in 1930, 3,507 in 1931, and 6,982 in 1932. At the initiative of the Communist Party, a wide network of legal left-wing newspapers (over 300 titles) was created in Poland. The central organ of the party was the illegal newspaper Czerwony Sztandar ("Red Banner") and the magazine Nowy Przegląd ("New Review")[5]

The Spanish Civil War
The members of the party took part in the Spanish Civil War. The Polish Communists fought as part of the Dombrowski inter-brigade.

The Comintern Line
The end of the 1920s - the beginning of the 1930s is marked by the so—called "third period" of the Comintern[7]. In the context of this tactic, the fifth congress of the Polish Communist Party was held in 1930, at which the PPP was characterized as a fascist party and the imminent onset of the revolution was announced. However, by the mid-1930s, the tactics had changed. In 1935-1937, according to the decisions of the Seventh Congress of the Comintern, the KPP advocated the unification of the actions of communists, socialists and other forces in the common struggle against fascism[5].

The factional struggle in the party began to fade in 1928-1933. The leaders of the "right" were ousted from leadership positions. In 1929, Julian Lensky became the general secretary of the Communist Party. By the end of the 1930s, the repressions were already affecting Lensky and his supporters. In the Soviet Union, leading figures of the KPP were shot: Adolf Varsky, Joseph Unschlicht, Edward Pruchnyak, Vera Kostsheva, Henryk Valetsky, Julian Lensky and many other Polish communists, such as the writer Bruno Jasensky. Together with the CHECKPOINT, its components were defeated: the Communist Party of Western Ukraine and the Communist Party of Western Belarus.

On August 16, 1938, the Executive Committee of the Comintern declared the Polish Communist Party "saboteur" and voted for its dissolution[8]. After the dissolution, Polish Communists continued to operate in trade unions and other public organizations. In January 1942, former members of the KPP led by Marcel Novotko, Pavel Finder, Malgorzata Fornalska, Boleslav Moloec and others initiated the creation of the Polish Workers' Party. In 1956, the CPSU, the Communist Party of Italy, the Communist Party of Bulgaria, the Communist Party of Finland and the Polish United Workers' Party in a joint statement recognized the dissolution of the KPP in 1938 as unjustified[5].

 

Without Soviet presence they meant nothing. Even as a nominal resistance force under occupation they meant nothing compared to other forces, like the Home Army.

[urbanoid]

1 minute ago, Roman Alymov said:

No, as Soviet Union was only founded in 1922, two years later  In 1920, there was still Civil War in Russia....

Potato, potato.

[Roman Alymov]

5 minutes ago, urbanoid said:

Without Soviet presence they meant nothing. Even as a nominal resistance force under occupation they meant nothing compared to other forces, like the Home Army.

Again, we could debate to what extent it was the result of repressions by Polish state (that was, obviously, not "communist-friendly", despite of very existance of independent Poland was sideeffect of Reds prevailing in Civil War in Russia).

[X-Files]

21 hours ago, Roman Alymov said:

North Korea is so advanced on high tech that their soldiers are able to connect to Internet without devices, by bare brain effort? The most obvious thing any reasonable military do when moving troops on classified mission is to prevent soldiers from using (and having) any sort of mobile devices that could be connected to Internet (and even cellular network).

 

You'd think so but we're talking about any military across the globe - "there's stupid, and then there's Army stupid"

 

IKYK

[urbanoid]

9 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said:

Again, we could debate to what extent it was the result of repressions by Polish state (that was, obviously, not "communist-friendly", despite of very existance of independent Poland was sideeffect of Reds prevailing in Civil War in Russia).

To an extent that after the war Stalin needed quite a lot of actual Soviets brought on the armor of Soviet tanks to fill in positions in the state administration, army and secret services. 

Given that local communists considered themselves loyal to the Soviet Union, not Poland, tolerating their activities was pretty much out of the question. Not that extreme nationalists were particularly tolerated either.

IIRC the interwar Poland redistributed more land to the peasants than the communists after 1945, there really was no reason to look to the communists for 'salvation', even less so after USSR started killing Poles for being Poles (that included Polish communists who fled to USSR).

Edited November 8, 2024 by urbanoid

[Stuart Galbraith]

30 minutes ago, urbanoid said:

To an extent that after the war Stalin needed quite a lot of actual Soviets brought on the armor of Soviet tanks to fill in positions in the state administration, army and secret services. 

Given that local communists considered themselves loyal to the Soviet Union, not Poland, tolerating their activities was pretty much out of the question. Not that extreme nationalists were particularly tolerated either.

IIRC the interwar Poland redistributed more land to the peasants than the communists after 1945, there really was no reason to look to the communists for 'salvation', even less so after USSR started killing Poles for being Poles (that included Polish communists who fled to USSR).

I was interested to read a story the other day that said that the first car built in Poland after the war had been recovered from Finland. The interesting thing is the first owner of it was Marshall Rokosovsky, whom was fulfilling the role of Polish defence minister at the time. For obvious reasons...

[Roman Alymov]

13 minutes ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

I was interested to read a story the other day that said that the first car built in Poland after the war had been recovered from Finland. The interesting thing is the first owner of it was Marshall Rokosovsky, whom was fulfilling the role of Polish defence minister at the time. For obvious reasons...

I hope you understand the fact Konstanty Rokossowski was ethnic Pole from aristocratic family. Curiously, in his personal Communist Party candidate card dated 1920 he, for unknown reasins, have put Warsaw as place of birth (while in fact he was born in Velikiye Luki). 

   What we know is he was undistinguishable from "Polish Pole" by natives:

"On August 8 (21), 1914, the advanced detachments of the Kargopol cavalry regiment discovered enemy cavalry units near the town of Nowe Miasto nad Pilitzon in the Ravsky district of the Petrokov province of the Warsaw Governorate-General. A volunteer of private rank Rokossovsky in civilian clothes went to the city, where he talked with the residents and managed to find out that it was occupied by a German cavalry regiment. The information was confirmed, and Konstantin Rokossovsky was awarded the St. George Cross of the IV degree No. 9841."

[alejandro_]

Ukraine and Russia exchanged bodies according to the formula 563 for 37

https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/7295396?from=top_main_5

Yes, Russia is advancing but that ratio is very high...
 

[Roman Alymov]

55 minutes ago, urbanoid said:

To an extent that after the war Stalin needed quite a lot of actual Soviets brought on the armor of Soviet tanks to fill in positions in the state administration, army and secret services. 

    Nothing strange here, Poland isbig enough to require tens of thousands (or even more) qualified people to run, it is strange to expect local Communusts/Socialists were able to provide such number after losses of, first, pre-war Poland regime and then Nazi occupation.  For obvious reasons, people from previous administrations were unfit for the jobs, so what is left?

59 minutes ago, urbanoid said:

Given that local communists considered themselves loyal to the Soviet Union, not Poland, tolerating their activities was pretty much out of the question. Not that extreme nationalists were particularly tolerated either.

No idea whom they were loyal to (interesting to compare it to British workers we have discussed yesterday in another thread). 

1 hour ago, urbanoid said:

IIRC the interwar Poland redistributed more land to the peasants than the communists after 1945,

How much of this land was granted in Kresy Wschodnie? ( for our non-Slavic mwmbers - "Eastern regions", the Polish name of the territories of present-day Ukraine (part of Galicia, western Ukraine), Belarus (Western Belarus) and Lithuania) 

"In December 1920, a special decree was issued on the colonization of lands with the Ukrainian population in the eastern territories of Poland — "Kresov Vshodnih" (Western Ukraine, Western Belarus, Eastern Lithuania), by Polish military settlers. In 1924, the Polish parliament adopted a special so-called Kresy Law, according to which bilingual schooling was introduced in order to assimilate the local population in Western Ukraine and Western Belarus.

On the basis of this law, during the period 1920-1928, 260,000 hectares of land were transferred to Polish settlers, former military, in Volhynia and Polesie, to which more than 20,000 settlers arrived from central Poland. The former military were supposed to guard the so-called "Polishness" and become a stronghold of Polish colonization in territories with a predominant Ukrainian population.

......   During the implementation of the law on land division in the territory of the "Kresov Vshodnih" (Western Ukraine, Western Belarus, Eastern Lithuania), 60 thousand Polish civilian settlers also arrived." (Восточные кресы — Википедия)

1 hour ago, urbanoid said:

......even less so after USSR started killing Poles for being Poles (that included Polish communists who fled to USSR).

Poles like Rokossowski, commander of 1st and then 2nd Belorussian Front?

[Stuart Galbraith]

21 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said:

I hope you understand the fact Konstanty Rokossowski was ethnic Pole from aristocratic family. Curiously, in his personal Communist Party candidate card dated 1920 he, for unknown reasins, have put Warsaw as place of birth (while in fact he was born in Velikiye Luki). 

   What we know is he was undistinguishable from "Polish Pole" by natives:

"On August 8 (21), 1914, the advanced detachments of the Kargopol cavalry regiment discovered enemy cavalry units near the town of Nowe Miasto nad Pilitzon in the Ravsky district of the Petrokov province of the Warsaw Governorate-General. A volunteer of private rank Rokossovsky in civilian clothes went to the city, where he talked with the residents and managed to find out that it was occupied by a German cavalry regiment. The information was confirmed, and Konstantin Rokossovsky was awarded the St. George Cross of the IV degree No. 9841."

Oh I see, so he was made a Marshall of the Soviet Union for being a loyal Pole! How silly of me. And here is me thinking Stalin did it to repress Poland and make an armed forces loyal to Stalin.

 

[Roman Alymov]

14 minutes ago, alejandro_ said:

Ukraine and Russia exchanged bodies according to the formula 563 for 37

https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/7295396?from=top_main_5

Yes, Russia is advancing but that ratio is very high...
 

Reportedly, about 60 of this corpses are pro-Ukrainias who were killed by Patriot missile strike on Il-76 when they were transported for prisoners exchange.