Kiev Is Burning

[Stefan Kotsch]

3 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said:

Could you please point out ANY country on this planet that could totally avoid having business with China (not even at war)?

BTW.:

Vashnye Istorie [~Significant Historical Events] is a Russian investigative web project that likes to stir up unpleasant things. You are now writing:

Bracing on a broken arm
The Russian economy has become critically dependent on the Chinese economy. And there are big problems in China too

“When America sneezes, the whole world gets sick,” is a common saying among financiers, reflecting the importance of its economy to everyone else. But for Russia, the health of China, and not America, is now more important. “Important stories” have already been told about the increasing economic dependence on it, which will obviously only increase. Therefore, it makes sense to assess the situation of the Chinese economy: because if it sneezes, Russia threatens to fall into a high fever.

It summarizes what ails China, that China's economic model has reached its limits, that China's internal condition offers little hope of improvement and that Russia has now plunged into this vortex.

https://istories.media/en/opinions/2022/06/08/how-russian-business-evades-western-sanctions/

[RETAC21]

Just now, Roman Alymov said:

US South did not wanted to be US anymore - still, now they are. Re "and Russia agreed they weren't" - not Russia but comprador post-Soviet elite did.

The US did not agree that the US South will be independent.

But Russia did agree that Ukraine was another country, and Russians voted in the Russian president that recognized Ukraine as independent.

[Roman Alymov]

2 hours ago, RETAC21 said:

The West military reputation seems to remain intact, as other than some Iranian tools, no one has been tempted to do something stupid. Other than Russia, that is.

  US bases and ships are attacked by missiles, drones shot down, as US claim, in ingternational airspace - but US is unable/unwilling to do anything about it.... 

[RETAC21]

7 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said:

Could you please point out ANY country on this planet that could totally avoid having business with China (not even at war)? Are you sure the device you are writing this message from is free of Made in China components? Is your local Internet connection and  electric grid free or them? And so on...  

Sure, but I am not dependent on them, while Russia has no other source for this components any more (well, North Korea...). What the Chinese want, Russia needs to give, or lose the war.

[RETAC21]

1 minute ago, Roman Alymov said:

  US bases and ships are attacked by missiles, drones shot down, as US claim, in ingternational airspace - but US is unable/unwilling to do anything about it.... 

And that shows what? that the US is able to shoot down drones or that they US is a global power with bases all over the World? that Iran can fly a few drones to hit empty barracks because they live in fear of the US carrier sitting on the doorstep? Taiwan pretty much shows that the second largest power is not ready to risk crossing a red line that may bring the US into a war.

[Roman Alymov]

Just now, RETAC21 said:

The US did not agree that the US South will be independent.

But Russia did agree that Ukraine was another country, and Russians voted in the Russian president that recognized Ukraine as independent.

I do not know how many times i have posted it here.....

Now it is widely acknowleged in Russia that actually Communist candidate won in 1996 (note i am not saying Communists mod.1996 were much better than former high-ranking Communist Party official Yeltsin, but still...)

[Roman Alymov]

3 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

Sure, but I am not dependent on them, while Russia has no other source for this components any more (well, North Korea...). What the Chinese want, Russia needs to give, or lose the war.

Try doing without them, and you will know the degree of dependence. 

Chinese components found in B-1 bombers and F-16 fighters — RT USA News

[RETAC21]

Just now, Roman Alymov said:

I do not know how many times i have posted it here.....

Now it is widely acknowleged in Russia that actually Communist candidate won in 1996 (note i am not saying Communists mod.1996 were much better than former high-ranking Communist Party official Yeltsin, but still...)

Which is cool, because Russia recognized Ukraine independence in 1991 and its borders in 1994, so it's completely irrelevant.

[Roman Alymov]

Just now, RETAC21 said:

Which is cool, because Russia recognized Ukraine independence in 1991 and its borders in 1994, so it's completely irrelevant.

Note in 1991 Russia was ruled by the same bunch of people, so it is quite relevant.

[RETAC21]

1 minute ago, Roman Alymov said:

Try doing without them, and you will know the degree of dependence. 

Chinese components found in B-1 bombers and F-16 fighters — RT USA News

And the US took them out and replaced them... so they do without them.

[RETAC21]

1 minute ago, Roman Alymov said:

Note in 1991 Russia was ruled by the same bunch of people, so it is quite relevant.

But not with Western money and advisers, they were grown in Russia as good Communists and the Russians voted for them when they had to choose rules.

[Roman Alymov]

5 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

And that shows what? that the US is able to shoot down drones or that they US is a global power with bases all over the World? that Iran can fly a few drones to hit empty barracks because they live in fear of the US carrier sitting on the doorstep? Taiwan pretty much shows that the second largest power is not ready to risk crossing a red line that may bring the US into a war.

It was US drone shot down

What We Know About Iran Shooting Down a U.S. Drone - The New York Times (nytimes.com)

Re "empty barracs" 

Iran missile attack: US troops were injured despite Pentagon initially saying there were no casualties | CNN Politics

[Roman Alymov]

6 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

And the US took them out and replaced them... so they do without them.

How do you know ALL of them were taken out and replaced (or even found)? :)

[seahawk]

39 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

For starters, they weren't Russians, but Ukrainians. Different nationality, not Russia's problem.

But Ukrainians are Russians, so the Russians had to intervene to stop Russians from killing Russians.

[RETAC21]

18 minutes ago, seahawk said:

But Ukrainians are Russians, so the Russians had to intervene to stop Russians from killing Russians.

But Russians couldn't intervene if the Russians were already there killing Russians, because the Russians had already intervened when the first Russian was killed. It's a chicken and egg question really... 

[Stuart Galbraith]

41 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said:

I do not know how many times i have posted it here.....

Now it is widely acknowleged in Russia that actually Communist candidate won in 1996 (note i am not saying Communists mod.1996 were much better than former high-ranking Communist Party official Yeltsin, but still...)

But still, you would rather have the Commies running your country into the ground yet again. Gotcha.

[seahawk]

25 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

But Russians couldn't intervene if the Russians were already there killing Russians, because the Russians had already intervened when the first Russian was killed. It's a chicken and egg question really... 

And if Russians intervene to stop Russians from killing Russians, are they not actually killing even more Russians? So many questions.

[Roman Alymov]

45 minutes ago, seahawk said:

But Ukrainians are Russians, so the Russians had to intervene to stop Russians from killing Russians.

In this logic, correct way to describe it is "Russian separatists (pretending to be Elves Ukrainians) were killing Russian unionists". Still no place for real Russian Gov (not pro-Western comprador one) to stay out.

[Roman Alymov]

52 minutes ago, Stuart Galbraith said:

But still, you would rather have the Commies running your country into the ground yet again. Gotcha.

Few years of comprador ex-Commies rule have made the years of non-comprador Commies rule seen as paradsise lost for most of Russians (still, you are correct at pointing out real Zuganov was hardly any better then real Yeltsin - as proved by decades of his cooperation with first Yeltsin, and then Putin).

[Roman Alymov]

2 hours ago, Stefan Kotsch said:

BTW.:

Vashnye Istorie [~Significant Historical Events] is a Russian investigative web project that likes to stir up unpleasant things. You are now writing:

Bracing on a broken arm
The Russian economy has become critically dependent on the Chinese economy. And there are big problems in China too

“When America sneezes, the whole world gets sick,” is a common saying among financiers, reflecting the importance of its economy to everyone else. But for Russia, the health of China, and not America, is now more important. “Important stories” have already been told about the increasing economic dependence on it, which will obviously only increase. Therefore, it makes sense to assess the situation of the Chinese economy: because if it sneezes, Russia threatens to fall into a high fever.

It summarizes what ails China, that China's economic model has reached its limits, that China's internal condition offers little hope of improvement and that Russia has now plunged into this vortex.

https://istories.media/en/opinions/2022/06/08/how-russian-business-evades-western-sanctions/

Thank you for bothering to bring here Vazhnye Istorii (official foreign agent and officialy banned as fake news source in Russia), but even if you assume this story is true - at what point it is making the situation for West any better?

[Roman Alymov]

2 hours ago, RETAC21 said:

Not contradictory at all, there are multiple factors that play into how competitive a economy is, and energy is just one of them, so an increase in the price of energy will impact the ability to sell German products in principle, but then you must take into account these increase is across the board, so not only Germany is impacted, but the whole global economy (remember India was/is buying cheap Russian oil and then selling it at market prices, pocketing the difference).

You mean German economists and industrialists were not competent enough to single out the effects of free Russian energy from "multiple factors" and make balanced business decisions?  Nobody was forcing them to buy Russian (and before that, Soviet) NG for - more over, US was actively levereging against that. 

    Re "India ....... pocketing the difference" - the same was doing Germany (by trasnforming NG into industry products of much higher value), the difference is India is now  BUYING oil (may be at lower price) while West was able to have it for free (as money were politely put back into West's pocket by the hands of pro-Western comprador Russian elite, only leaving small part to keep Russian population from revolt). That is why ANY deal with "global South" is massively better for Russia than any deal for West.

[Wouter2]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-67722252

Eu opens membership talks with Ukraine and Moldova.

[RETAC21]

2 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said:

You mean German economists and industrialists were not competent enough to single out the effects of free Russian energy from "multiple factors" and make balanced business decisions?  Nobody was forcing them to buy Russian (and before that, Soviet) NG for - more over, US was actively levereging against that. 

    Re "India ....... pocketing the difference" - the same was doing Germany (by trasnforming NG into industry products of much higher value), the difference is India is now  BUYING oil (may be at lower price) while West was able to have it for free (as money were politely put back into West's pocket by the hands of pro-Western comprador Russian elite, only leaving small part to keep Russian population from revolt). That is why ANY deal with "global South" is massively better for Russia than any deal for West.

This is a gross simplification and on top, it's incorrect.

You seem to have an incredible awe of the Germans for some reason. Balanced business decisions were taken on the assumption that Russia wasn't stupid and would start a war that it cannot win, but then Russia started acting irrational, and that carries a price, but a price that Germany can pay and seems that Putin didn't expect them to, well, he betted wrong.

As for the West and South, you keep on harping these simplifications as if they are real and meaningful, but you are wrong, each country has different interests even within the West and South, and some will take advantage of Russia while others won't, but what is certain, is that Russia won't profit from any of it, all by its own doing.

[Roman Alymov]

6 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

You seem to have an incredible awe of the Germans for some reason. 

German industrialists are traditionally highly respected in Russia.

13 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

Balanced business decisions were taken on the assumption that Russia wasn't stupid and would start a war that it cannot win, but then Russia started acting irrational, and that carries a price, but a price that Germany can pay and seems that Putin didn't expect them to, well, he betted wrong.

What's the difference for business owner in, for example, Indonesia who is choosing between German-made machine tool and China-made machine tool, is Russia at war or not? He will not be happy to pay extra for German-made machine tool for being "Russia-free"  - especially if one from China competitor will be even more cheap because of now China able to leverage better energy price......

14 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

As for the West and South, you keep on harping these simplifications as if they are real and meaningful, but you are wrong, each country has different interests even within the West and South, and some will take advantage of Russia while others won't, but what is certain, is that Russia won't profit from any of it, all by its own doing.

See above, for a long time business with ANY Western country was profiting Russian elite but hardly Russia as nation - while, contrary, deals with almost ANY "south" nation is profiting Russia as nation. Of course it is simplificatgion, bit still communicating the general idea.

[Josh]

2 hours ago, Roman Alymov said:

US South did not wanted to be US anymore - still, now they are. Re "and Russia agreed they weren't" - not Russia but comprador post-Soviet elite did.

The U.S. south wasn’t an independent country for three decades, nor did the north explicitly sign a declaration ensuring its security.

If Russia wants to invade Ukraine, ok, the US certainly started more than its fair share of invasions. But don’t pretend this was inevitable or Russias only option: there were plenty of diplomatic and even military options short of a long winded war of annexation that would have “saved Russian lives” with out wasting so many Russian lives.