Markus Becker Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 Turkey now approves Nato membership of Sweden and Finnland. Did he give in or was a deal, deal cut? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markus Becker Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 (edited) https://i.postimg.cc/cC6930SZ/FWUQqjv-WAAAr9d-A.jpg Edited June 28, 2022 by Markus Becker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yama Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 Erdogan is a paper tiger, all he ever wanted was to do some posturing and then was 'satisfied' with some symbolic 'gains'. As far as I know, we made no concrete assurances whatsoever. Any extradition is a judicial matter and out of the hands of politicians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 Probably a little of everything. He still relies on the US for aircraft and there’s no easy way to turn that off, plus this would be a horrible time for US tariffs to scale back up (I believe they were decreased under Trump). It’s also possible he was given something in northern Syria as compensation. Maybe some kind of economic assistance will be forthcoming to help with the 70% inflation. It probably will take a long time for the arrangement to come to light, but I doubt the Receptionist changed his mind on a whim: he either was threatened with something he couldn’t stomach or he got something in return, or both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huba Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 Here's a summary: And the whole text of the memorandum: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markus Becker Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Josh said: Probably a little of everything. He still relies on the US for aircraft and there’s no easy way to turn that off, ... Very easy. Turkey still has all it's Cold War stuff. Some in reserve, much up for replacement, like BTR, M44, 52 and 110 SPG and them there is that S-400. I bet if he sold that to Ukraine, he'd get the F-16. PS: About that shopping mall. I read the Russians fired heavy anti ship missiles. Huh? Edited June 28, 2022 by Markus Becker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BansheeOne Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 Overused at this point, but still appropriate: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yama Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 7 minutes ago, Markus Becker said: PS: About that shopping mall. I read the Russians fired heavy anti ship missiles. Huh? Kh-22 (or probably Kh-32 actually). Even in modernized form, they probably aren't as accurate as Kalibr or Iskander. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 Vyborg or bust! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urbanoid Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 37 minutes ago, Markus Becker said: I read the Russians fired heavy anti ship missiles. Huh? They're dual use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huba Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 It seems airbase in Kursk was struck, video in the thread below shows a pillar of smoke and multiple secondary explosions. Apparently a small parachute was found nearby - what is it? A retarding parachute from Tochka cluster bomblet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yama Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 Maybe Tu-141? Ukrainians have modified them as ersatz cruise missiles. They have not had much success before though, at least once missing the Russia altogether. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der Zeitgeist Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 1 hour ago, Markus Becker said: Very easy. Turkey still has all it's Cold War stuff. Some in reserve, much up for replacement, like BTR, M44, 52 and 110 SPG and them there is that S-400. I bet if he sold that to Ukraine, he'd get the F-16. PS: About that shopping mall. I read the Russians fired heavy anti ship missiles. Huh? I mean there’s no easy way for Turkey to not use F-16s and rely on a US part stream, and that type is basically their entire Air Force. Painful if the Greeks suddenly get F-35s as well, which was rumored to be discussed and probably turned down just it could be on the table again. I think most any Russian AShM has an land attack mode or land attack version. Bastion, Kh-22, etc. not sure what type of weapon is alleged but the Soviets/Russians often had over lap between the two. NATO tended to only operate small sea skimming turbojet AShMs that had no surface strike, but now a days anything with GOS guidance can find a particular spot on earth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 5 minutes ago, Der Zeitgeist said: Well it’s definitely being tossed… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Alymov Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 1 hour ago, Yama said: Kh-22 (or probably Kh-32 actually). Even in modernized form, they probably aren't as accurate as Kalibr or Iskander. How could pro-Ukrainians know? Here is the crater left by missile hit into the plant workshops - seems too big for cruise missile, so probably some secondary detonation CCTV view of the explosion - note the pond is on opposite side pof the plant from shopping mall. Also note people run first (but not in panic as first explosion was telatively weak) then second, much more powerfil explosion came - probably as ammunition storage blast off map - red circle is mall, blue is plant, green is city pond Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der Zeitgeist Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 (edited) Oh, and we can now also lay to rest the lies that @Roman Alymovwas spreading earlier (and also right before this post, again). There's now video of the Russian missile scoring a direct hit on the shopping centre in Kremenchuk. The camera is looking south-west from the scrapyard across the mall. The mall itself can be identified by the raised yellow section on the roof. Edited June 28, 2022 by Der Zeitgeist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der Zeitgeist Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 5 minutes ago, Roman Alymov said: CCTV view of the explosion - note the pond is on opposite side pof the plant from shopping mall. Also note people run first (but not in panic as first explosion was telatively weak) then second, much more powerfil explosion came - probably as ammunition storage blast off No, the first explosion wasn't weak, it was just further away. That was the one that hit the mall. You can even see the smoke in the video you posted. Also, if the version you're trying to spread here was true, there would have to be explosion damage north of the mall, but there isn't any, because it was a direct hit on the building. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Alymov Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 1 hour ago, Der Zeitgeist said: No, the first explosion wasn't weak, it was just further away. That was the one that hit the mall. You can even see the smoke in the video you posted. Also, if the version you're trying to spread here was true, there would have to be explosion damage north of the mall, but there isn't any, because it was a direct hit on the building. Well, then how in your theory you would explain this CCTV video of missile hitting storage yard of Kremenchug plant? Video https://t.me/boris_rozhin/55482 Location, note guard tower Also, in your logic, where is missile impact crater inside the ruins of shopping mall and what caused destruction in plant open storage yard? https://t.me/boris_rozhin/55488 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Alymov Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 (edited) P.S. Incoming missile with coic nose really look like X-22. so taking into consideration how accurate the strike was (right into the area where rail line is entering the plant) - seems like rumors of it is "less acurate" are just rumors, or old X-22 airframes are modified with new guidence system (as Russian taxpayer i fully support this prudent approach) Edited June 28, 2022 by Roman Alymov Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 Considering that Russia has hit grain silos and other food export infrastructure, it seems pretty clear that civilian casualties and suffering are part of the goal regardless of the details of this strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiGG0 Posted June 29, 2022 Share Posted June 29, 2022 5 hours ago, Josh said: Considering that Russia has hit grain silos and other food export infrastructure, it seems pretty clear that civilian casualties and suffering are part of the goal regardless of the details of this strike. IMO not goal, but irrelevant in their choice of targets. This strike looks quite clear to me that target was that factory area and mall was just "colleretal damage". It dont matter really, did missile hit it directly it or near it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der Zeitgeist Posted June 29, 2022 Share Posted June 29, 2022 (edited) 6 hours ago, Roman Alymov said: Well, then how in your theory you would explain this CCTV video of missile hitting storage yard of Kremenchug plant? Video https://t.me/boris_rozhin/55482 Location, note guard tower Also, in your logic, where is missile impact crater inside the ruins of shopping mall and what caused destruction in plant open storage yard? https://t.me/boris_rozhin/55488 Roman, please, you need to concentrate and really look at the stuff you're posting before you're posting it. If the impact location from your favourite Telegram channel was true, the explosion would have happened in front of the treeline in the video. But it the explosion was behind the treeline right on top of the mall, as the video shows. Edited June 29, 2022 by Der Zeitgeist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiGG0 Posted June 29, 2022 Share Posted June 29, 2022 UK MOD also believes that mall hit might be "Collaretal damage": Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Galbraith Posted June 29, 2022 Share Posted June 29, 2022 (edited) A view Id have some sympathy for, if they were not launching artillery strikes on urban areas since the first day of the war. They even used a hypersonic weapon on what appears to be a small farm, with absolutely no indications of any military use. This is no new, they have always fought this way. So either blame lack of empathy, lack of competence, it really doesnt matter. The venality is they launched a war with zero concern of the cost to Ukrainian life, and are still fighting that way. Edited June 29, 2022 by Stuart Galbraith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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