Polish Armoured Vehicles And Their Modernizations.

[urbanoid]

[Damian]

Today 7 additional K2 Main Battle Tanks arrived to port in Gdynia. This means that Polish Land Forces so far received 22 K2's. These 7 tanks will be delivered to 20th Mechanized Brigade, to start tank crews training, remianing 15 tanks serve in 15th Mechanized Brigade. Both 15th and 20th Mechanized Brigades are part of 16th Mechanized Division.

[Damian]

Today Vice Prime Minister, Minister of National Defence Mariusz Błaszczak, informed that first batch of M1 tanks for Poland had been shipped. First batch is a company of 14 M1A1FEP's and 3 M88A2's.

Poland ordered so far 116 M1A1FEP, 250 M1A2SEPv3, 38 M88A2 and 25 M1110 that will be delivered in 2023-2026.

But, there is more. During recent Defence24 Day conference, I had opportunity to listen and talk with GDLS representatives, including Mr Christopher Brown vice president of global strategy and international business development GDLS. So, Poland officialy become member of Team Abrams, and there are plans to build in Poland maintnance center called Abrams Center of Excellence. It will either be a completely new facility or based on existing Polish Arms Industry infrastructure. GDLS plans to invite to cooperation around 150 Polish companies, because there are plans to manufacture a lot of components and subsystems for M1 tanks in Poland.

Poland will also become a maintnance hub not only for Polish Army, but also US Army and Romanian Army and any other possible future Abrams user in Europe. There are also some other, larger opportunities for future.

[Damian]

Important news. GDLS signed teaming agreement with PGZ to create service center in Poland to provide maintnance for M1A1 and M1A2 Abrams Main Battle Tanks, M88A2 (and in future M88A3) Armored Recovery Vehicles, M1074/M1110 Joint Assault Bridge System and possibly M1150 Armored Breacher Vehicle.

Maintnance center will provide services to Polish Army, US Army and possibly other future users of these platforms in Europe like Romania. This is huge opportunity for both sides, and Polish industry is capable also to manufacture subsystems for these vehicles, at lower prices.

[RETAC21]

Apologies for taking this thread back to the Cold War, but I ran across an odd statement. Poland produced 1.610 T-72s between 1981 and 1991.

738 went to the Polish Army, 56 to Hungary, 156 to the GDR, 93 to Syria, apparenty 464 to Iraq, and I have seen Yemen as a custormer (presumably for the remaining 73), but I haven't found any source that says that Yemen had T-72s prior to 2000, so is this so or Yemen is incorrectly listed?

[Perun]

14 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

Apologies for taking this thread back to the Cold War, but I ran across an odd statement. Poland produced 1.610 T-72s between 1981 and 1991.

738 went to the Polish Army, 56 to Hungary, 156 to the GDR, 93 to Syria, apparenty 464 to Iraq, and I have seen Yemen as a custormer (presumably for the remaining 73), but I haven't found any source that says that Yemen had T-72s prior to 2000, so is this so or Yemen is incorrectly listed?

Interesting question

[Damian]

More information. Tommorow first 14 M1A1FEP's will arrive to Poland.
 

Also some schedules. This year first battalion of M1A1FEP's will be delivered. In 2024 second battalion will be delivered. Also there is a chance that in 2024 first of 250 M1A2SEPv3's might be delivered, so a few months ahead of schedule, but it's still uncertain.

[Damian]

48 minutes ago, RETAC21 said:

Apologies for taking this thread back to the Cold War, but I ran across an odd statement. Poland produced 1.610 T-72s between 1981 and 1991.

738 went to the Polish Army, 56 to Hungary, 156 to the GDR, 93 to Syria, apparenty 464 to Iraq, and I have seen Yemen as a custormer (presumably for the remaining 73), but I haven't found any source that says that Yemen had T-72s prior to 2000, so is this so or Yemen is incorrectly listed?

 

34 minutes ago, Perun said:

Interesting question

In book "Pancerny Bumar", Yemen (Jemen in Polish) is indeed mentioned on one page as export direction for T-72 tanks.

[Perun]

Thanks

[RETAC21]

10 hours ago, Damian said:

 

In book "Pancerny Bumar", Yemen (Jemen in Polish) is indeed mentioned on one page as export direction for T-72 tanks.

But is there any proof they were actually delivered? the more I search, the less I find

[Damian]

11 hours ago, RETAC21 said:

But is there any proof they were actually delivered? the more I search, the less I find

No proof. It seems there were ideas for that export direction, but might had been never realized.

[Damian]

First company of 14 M1A1FEP with 3 M88A2 for the Polish Army, was just unloaded in port of Szczecin in Poland. In 2023 Poland will receive in total 56 M1A1FEP's and in 2024 60 M1A1FEP's + 12 M88A2, 8 M1074/M1110, 6 M577A3 and 26 HMMWV's with NG SECM field repair shops.

 

 

Edited June 28, 2023 by Damian

[Damian]

MoD photos from unloading of 14 M1A1's and 3 M88A2's.

[Damian]

This year 15th August during Polish Armed Forces Day, we will see a lot of new vehicles and equipment.

[urbanoid]

Ha, the internet noticed Polish tactical penises camo.

 

[sunday]

Were some enlisted US Marines consulted during the process?

[Damian]

Ok so this might be interesting for @Stuart Galbraith @Perun and few other people I guess.

So there was a story that during Cold War, Poland was interested in procurement of a T-80 variant. However this appears to be some sort of urban legend. In reality what the government and the army were interested in the 1980's was a T-72S, the export variant of T-72B/B1.

Discussion was started in 1988 between PRL and USSR, however PRL was interested in differential documentation (in Polish dokumentacja różnicowa), because T-72S was seen as simply another T-72 variant. The Soviets seen it as a completely new vehicle, and wanted to sell complete documentation and license.

Obviously full documentation and license were far more expensive than differential documentation. When Warsaw Pact and Soviet Union collapsed, all negotiations stopped and Polish Government decided to fund national upgrade program for T-72M1 tanks, first codenamed as T-72M2D Wilk and then PT-91 Twardy.

It is unknown if T-72S was ever tested in Poland and photographed, but I will try to eventually find answers.

[Perun]

Thsnks

[Stuart Galbraith]

12 hours ago, Damian said:

Ok so this might be interesting for @Stuart Galbraith @Perun and few other people I guess.

So there was a story that during Cold War, Poland was interested in procurement of a T-80 variant. However this appears to be some sort of urban legend. In reality what the government and the army were interested in the 1980's was a T-72S, the export variant of T-72B/B1.

Discussion was started in 1988 between PRL and USSR, however PRL was interested in differential documentation (in Polish dokumentacja różnicowa), because T-72S was seen as simply another T-72 variant. The Soviets seen it as a completely new vehicle, and wanted to sell complete documentation and license.

Obviously full documentation and license were far more expensive than differential documentation. When Warsaw Pact and Soviet Union collapsed, all negotiations stopped and Polish Government decided to fund national upgrade program for T-72M1 tanks, first codenamed as T-72M2D Wilk and then PT-91 Twardy.

It is unknown if T-72S was ever tested in Poland and photographed, but I will try to eventually find answers.

Thank you Damian, thats really very interesting. Guess the Soviets shouldnt have dragged their feet.

 

[Zadlo]

On 7/24/2023 at 8:06 PM, Damian said:

Discussion was started in 1988

In 1987. In 1988 original production licence of T-72 was going to be expired.

Edited July 25, 2023 by Zadlo

[Damian]

3 minutes ago, Zadlo said:

In 1987. In 1988 original production licence of T-72 was going to be expired.

Good to know, "Pancerna Potęga PRL" provides date of 1988, probably a mistake.

[Damian]

August 15th we will celebrate Polish Armed Forces Day, with a great parade, here are photos from base of the 1st Armored Brigade where preparations are being made for celebrations. We can see here some of the new vehicles procured in recent years that will be presented during parade.

Important note, this is very important period of time, because finally we start to replace ex soviet vehicles and weapon systems.

These are just few examples. During parade we can also observe first 4 or 5 (it is uncertain yet) Borsuk IFV's that will gradually replace ancient BMP-1's.

[alejandro_]

On 7/24/2023 at 7:06 PM, Damian said:

Ok so this might be interesting for @Stuart Galbraith @Perun and few other people I guess.

So there was a story that during Cold War, Poland was interested in procurement of a T-80 variant. However this appears to be some sort of urban legend. In reality what the government and the army were interested in the 1980's was a T-72S, the export variant of T-72B/B1.

Apparently in the late 80s Hungary were offered the T-80UD (described as a T-80 with boxer type engine IIRC). I assume economical crisis meant that Soviets were more flexible with material offered for export.  

[Damian]

1 hour ago, alejandro_ said:

Apparently in the late 80s Hungary were offered the T-80UD (described as a T-80 with boxer type engine IIRC). I assume economical crisis meant that Soviets were more flexible with material offered for export.  

Interesting. Perhaps your theory is correct.

[Damian]

First company of M1A1FEP's from 1st Armored Brigade during excercises for parade. They look really great.