Polish Armoured Vehicles And Their Modernizations.

[Tantalwz88]

 

http://www.armyrecognition.com/december_2015_global_defense_security_news_uk/ukraine_poland_will_cooperate_to_develop_mortar_carrier_and_howitzer_based_on_t-84_oplot_tank_12912154.html

 

Interesting.

I think this is the interesting part:

Ukraines Morozov design bureau and Polands Huta Stalowa Wola are to develop a 120-mm APC-

mounted mortar and a 155-mm howitzer mounted on the Oplot tank chassis.

For export sales I presume. I do not think that Poland wants to introduce Oplots.

 

Other way i think ,Ukraine wants to introduce 120mm mortar and 155mm howitzer on tracked chassis for their own use and export to third parties.No talks about introducing Oplot tanks ,but technology barter is in full swing.

[urbanoid]

 

For export sales I presume. I do not think that Poland wants to introduce Oplots.

 

 

Their artillery isn't exactly up to date, so ...

 

It's not about us getting Oplots, but them putting Krab turrets on an Oplot chassis.

 

@Tantal

The article mentions BTR-4E with 120 mm mortar turret, not anything tracked.

http://www.ukrinform.ua/rubric-economics/1937351-ukroboronprom-ta-polyaki-rozroblyat-dva-novih-tipi-samohidnih-garmat.html

Edited December 29, 2015 by urbanoid

[Tantalwz88]

 

 

For export sales I presume. I do not think that Poland wants to introduce Oplots.

 

 

Their artillery isn't exactly up to date, so ...

 

It's not about us getting Oplots, but them putting Krab turrets on an Oplot chassis.

 

@Tantal

The article mentions BTR-4E with 120 mm mortar turret, not anything tracked.

http://www.ukrinform.ua/rubric-economics/1937351-ukroboronprom-ta-polyaki-rozroblyat-dva-novih-tipi-samohidnih-garmat.html

 

Putting Lobster turret on BTR-4E won't be easy.Going back to Leopard 2 modernisation it will cost 2 bilions and 415 milions złotych not 415 thousands złotych ,small change .

[alejandro_]

Poland is going to upgrade 128 Leopard-2.

 

The upgrade will include a modernisation of the MBTs' turret armour to a level at least that of the Leopard 2A5 variant, while not exceeding a total weight of 60 tons for the Leopard 2PL. This will include a partial change of the MBT's turret armour plates, and the addition of extra armour developed by IBD. Spall liners will also be added in the crew compartment of the turret, while internal storage and stowage capabilities will be extended.

The upgrade will see the tanks retain their existing L44 120 mm gun (rather than be upgraded with the longer L55 gun), although it and its fire control system will be upgraded for compatibility with the newest DM11 and DM63-type armour-piercing ammunition. A more substantial upgrade will come in the form of new commander and gunner sights incorporating the Polish PCO KLW-1 thermal imager, while the gun and turret stabiliser systems will be changed from hydraulic to electric.

 

http://www.janes.com/article/56972/poland-orders-128-upgraded-leopard-2pl-main-battle-tanks

 

Information on thermal camera to be installed:

 

http://www.pcosa.com.pl/en/terrain_imaging_systems/klw-1_asteria_thermal_camera-29.html

[Panzermann]

 

 

Information on thermal camera to be installed:

 

http://www.pcosa.com.pl/en/terrain_imaging_systems/klw-1_asteria_thermal_camera-29.html

Ah instead of lazily putting a multi megabyte pdf made from converted .ppt presentations an actual assembled compact pdf. How refreshing. www.pcosa.com.pl/pliki_do_pobrania/produkty/web_KLW1_EN.pdf

 

 

Though only 2×/4× magnification? Isn't that a bit low? Or is that going to be combined with optical magnification to go up to 10× or so?

[alejandro_]

Though only 2×/4× magnification? Isn't that a bit low?

 

I looked at the Catherine specifications -see below-. Resolution is higher but zoom is the same.

 

https://www.thalesgroup.com/sites/default/files/asset/document/1.1%20-%20Cath%20MP%20Datasheet%20.pdf

[alejandro_]

Poland is considering the use of Ukrainian components in PT-91 modernization.

http://lenta.ru/news/2016/01/11/cooperation/

[urbanoid]

And vice versa - in T-64/72 and BMP-1 modernization.

[alejandro_]

I have a question about Polish armoured forces. If Communist regime/Warsaw Pact had not fallen apart, what Soviet armour was next? Did the Soviets offered T-72B/T-80? Were there any negotiations?

Edited January 13, 2016 by alejandro_

[urbanoid]

We negotiated to produce T-72B on license, but the Soviets wanted to treat it as a new tank (which would require signing new license agreement), while our side saw it as an upgrade (would not require new agreement). To be precise it would have been T-72S , i.e. 'monkey model'. We also planned to upgrade base T-72, as well as A and M1 versions to one standard. And then came 1989 and we decided not to continue the negotiations.

 

As for T-80 there are some rumors that we negotiated buying the license for it, but don't have any precise data, I'm not even sure if it really took place. Part of the RUMINT is that T-80 was too advanced for our then-MIC.

[bojan]

...To be precise it would have been T-72S...

 

Difference to B is marginal, no external anti-radiation liner and few less ERA bricks.

[Damian]

Our new SPH 155mm AHS Krab is right now going through last state trails before it will be accepted for service and mass production will start.

 

 

More info's here, in Polish.

 

http://www.defence24.pl/306229,krab-na-ostatniej-prostej-foto

[urbanoid]

Those are K9 chassis and (better) AS90s turrets.

[Panzermann]

I wonder if the mechanics need two boxes of tools? One DIN and the other imperial?

[urbanoid]

The turret is license-produced, so I guess everything should be made using a civilized measurement system.

[Damian]

These days using a computer you can easy recalculate everything in a meassuring system you want to use.

 

Anyway, if UK would want to, we can upgrade your turrets with the longer guns we use, and also put them on our polonized K9 chassis, because HSW purchased a complete license for that chassis with rights to use it for their own further R&D, modify it or export it, so there would be no problem with that.

 

Heck if UK would want and pay, we could build completely new ones for you guys.

 

 

By the way, speaking about tanks.

 

First Leopard 2A4's are currently being disassembled in ZM Bumar-Łabędy manufacturing plant for refurbishement and preparation for modernization.

 

Meanwhile for maintnance and eventuall modernization of Leopard 2A5 tanks, it seems that responsible will be WZM plant currently servicing powerpacks.

 

http://vod.tvp.pl/23625511index.html06022016

 

Disassembling of tanks can be seen here at 11:30.

 

And below some photos.

 

 

ZB Bumar-Łabędy is finally under management of successfull Rosomak company, that manufactures Rosomak APC's, so maybe, maybe they finally gonna start to function properly. And there is planned lots of investitions in to this plant, for new machines, tools and so on, I hope this time they won't fuck this up.

Edited February 11, 2016 by Damian

[Damian]

Hey, we want to make business, so if anyone wants to, we are open for negotiations.

[Damian]

Tests of our active protection system.

 

[Damian]

 

New tankers during their basic course.

 

More photos can be found on 10th Armored Cavalry Brigade facebook fanpage.

 

https://www.facebook.com/10BKPanc/?fref=photo

 

Also worth to open are fanpages of the whole 11th Armored Cavalry Division -> https://www.facebook.com/czarna.dywizja/?fref=ts

And Armor Museum in Poznań, localized just next to the Ground Forces Training Center -> https://www.facebook.com/MBPanc/?fref=ts

 

Worth to visit to check their renovation programs on few vehicles.

 

PS. I forgot, if you want to see something older than Leopard 2's, then here is fanpage of 9th Armored Cavalry Brigade -> https://www.facebook.com/9-Brygada-Kawalerii-Pancernej-1438641989682026/?fref=ts

 

T-72M1 tanks that were used in the past by 9th Armored Cavalry Brigade, recently replaced by PT-91's.

Edited February 15, 2016 by Damian

[Damian]

Some videos with tanks and other AFV's I tought you guys might want to watch.

[Dark_Falcon]

Very cool stuff. thanks.

[Damian]

 

From the last year Armed Forces Day, it was near National Stadium where static display was made, this year they will make static display there as well most likely.

[Tantalwz88]

Rheinmetall signed the deal with Bumar Łabędy for the modernisation of Leo2A4 for Polish land forces.First Leopard 2PL should be ready in march of 2018 ,tanks will be able to use DM63 and DM11 programmable ammo.

 

http://www.altair.com.pl/news/view?news_id=18711

 

- PERI R-17A3 and EMES-15 will use Polish PCO S.A. KLW-1 Asteria third gen thermal camera.

- Rheinmetall is ready to certificate polish made 120mm ammo and if needed to sell the license for DM63 and DM11 to Poland.

- Rh will also offer the 120mm Light Low Recoil L47 cannon for the future fire support vehicle made in Obrum.

 

Damian will write the rest ,his english is better than mine .

[Old ROF]

...........

 

Anyway, if UK would want to, we can upgrade your turrets with the longer guns we use, and also put them on our polonized K9 chassis, because HSW purchased a complete license for that chassis with rights to use it for their own further R&D, modify it or export it, so there would be no problem with that.

 

Heck if UK would want and pay, we could build completely new ones for you guys.

 

............

 

 

I know the original ordnance were supplied by the UK but do you know who now manufactures the ordnance. The basic tube and mounting arrangement looks like the AS90-ERO configuration but the Muzzle Brake is completely different to that used on the UK 52 cal ordnance. Is the breech still the split block AS90 configuration or has it been changed.

[Tantalwz88]

 

...........

 

Anyway, if UK would want to, we can upgrade your turrets with the longer guns we use, and also put them on our polonized K9 chassis, because HSW purchased a complete license for that chassis with rights to use it for their own further R&D, modify it or export it, so there would be no problem with that.

 

Heck if UK would want and pay, we could build completely new ones for you guys.

 

............

 

 

I know the original ordnance were supplied by the UK but do you know who now manufactures the ordnance. The basic tube and mounting arrangement looks like the AS90-ERO configuration but the Muzzle Brake is completely different to that used on the UK 52 cal ordnance. Is the breech still the split block AS90 configuration or has it been changed.

 

If i am not wrong we bought license from France for the Barrels.Edit - Barrels were made by Aubert & Duval and Nexter.

Edited February 18, 2016 by Tantalwz88