sunday Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 Our Ken Estes participed me of the first reviews of his book on the 1st. Marine Provisional Brigade and the fight at Pusan Perimeter. Those reviews look very good. The review in Leatherneck magazine ends in this way: Slight in size and focused in scope for such an intense military study, “Into the Breach at Pusan,”nonetheless, proves to be a remarkable blend of writing: brief, well-organized, authoritative, andso admirably direct in presentation that it will be read and understood by any interested reader.However, for the military-minded reader, Estes’ frankness and clarity of strategic exposition,along with his shrewdness in evaluating and depicting complex perimeter fighting, as well aselucidating the human factors of high command in battle decision making, lead us not onlyto a whole new appreciation of the Pusan defense, but also catapults “Into the Breach” as apermanent high-level reference that all military people must read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Pellagio Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 No kindle edition... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Tanker Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 I'll buy it. Politics aside Ken is a good historian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmgill Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 (edited) I'll buy it. Politics aside Ken is a good historian. Yeah, I have a hard time fitting those together given the timbre of his exchanges. I was glad to know we have had him on this board but jebus, some of his points of rhetoric. I do hope his book sells. I'll point my Gyrene buddies towards it. Edited September 12, 2012 by rmgill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmgill Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 Well, the Marine vet at work looked at the Amazon listing I sent him and responded with, "Sweeeeeettt!!!! I’ll pick one up." Fred LOVES his history books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunday Posted September 12, 2012 Author Share Posted September 12, 2012 I'll buy it. Politics aside Ken is a good historian. And writes really well. I found his "Tank on the Beaches" more easy to read than anything from Clancy. Pretty on par with Tom Wolfe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 Just finished his "Marines under Armour" he gave me when I visited, like many TN types far less snarly in person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baboon6 Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 I'll buy it. Politics aside Ken is a good historian. Yeah, I have a hard time fitting those together given the timbre of his exchanges. I was glad to know we have had him on this board but jebus, some of his points of rhetoric. I do hope his book sells. I'll point my Gyrene buddies towards it. I try to stay out of political discussions on this forum (and others too). It always ends up like people screaming at each other. You're never going to convince someone on the internet that your political opinions are more valid than theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmgill Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 I try to stay out of political discussions on this forum (and others too). It always ends up like people screaming at each other. You're never going to convince someone on the internet that your political opinions are more valid than theirs. I dunno, I have succeeded the past and I've had my own opinions swayed by well formulated points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RETAC21 Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 The book is very good, he gave me a copy some time back and it's a page turner, I finished it off in a weekend with children and all, well researched and pulls some punches on USMC myths, I put up a critic on the Tanknet authors thread at King Sargent Military history section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m1a1mg Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 I've had the pleasure of dining with the man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fritz Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I generally do not comment on issues like this but I fully support this statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RETAC21 Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 (edited) x Answered by PM. Edited September 23, 2012 by RETAC21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corinthian Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Popcorn anyone? Guys, cool it. Focus on the book(s). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typhoid Maxx Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Sure. Chilled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RETAC21 Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Popcorn anyone? Guys, cool it. Focus on the book(s). Put the popcorn away, I was just curious, and Maxx has explained himself well enough for me, so we can go back to the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T19 Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 I hope the book does really well. There are reasons why religion, politics and women are not spoken about in polite company. NOTE a woman is not a Lady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmgill Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Is Tanknet polite company? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 Is Tanknet polite company? As long as they stay away from the internet. My wife has approved of every Tanknetter we have met and that would be about 10 or so (so far) I have met about another 15-20 all interesting and nice people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MODERATOR Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 WARNING TO ALL: THIS IS NOT THE FFZ. Topics outside of the FFZ are not to drift off-topic, nor are they places for commentary ala FFZ. ALSO, the decisions and actions of MODERATOR are final and are not up for public debate or referendum in any forum inside Tanknet, by anybody, at any time, or for any reason. MODERATOR is not one person. MODERATOR is usually a number of ten or more Staff members governing Tanknet. MODERATOR decisions are finalized by majority vote. Stay on topic. Discuss the book, as per the thread title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Estes Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 The review from Dec 2012 Naval History [Naval Inst Press], written by Col. Dick Camp, concludes: The Pusan Perimeter (1954) the firstof the official history’s five volumes,thus embellished the role of the fire brigadeand was deliberately self-serving,according to Estes. Yet, even thoughhe attacks in no uncertain terms the“rhetorical excesses and exaggerations[that] have distorted the history of theMarine brigade at Pusan,” the authoris also careful to point out that “thebrigade’s accomplishments in Korea arein no way diminished by an accurateaccount of its operations.” Estes’ Intothe Breach at Pusan is a well-writtenand researched book that persuasivelychallenges the lore surrounding the 1stProvisional Marine Brigade. I expectit to spark spirited discussion, and KenEstes may well be advised to wear a flakjacket and helmet when the fire brigade’sconventional defenders come outof the bushes with “guns” blazing. Perhaps this is the effect of my rhetoric, with which Ryan has difficulties? Military History, had [Jan, 2013 online]:Into the Breach at Pusan shows that 1st PMG personnel entered the fray in Korea with a lack of wartime experience. Brig. Gen. Edward A. Craig was the exception that proved the rule. During World War I he had sent a telegram to his father, stating: "I'm entering the Marine Corps." The reply he received read: "Do not join the U.S. Marines under any circumstances. A terrible bunch of drunks and bums. Father." That attitude persisted among senior U.S. Army officers, such as General of the Army Douglas MacArthur, who in a conversation with Lt. Gen. George E. Stratemeyer called the Marine inferior to the common American soldier.Author Estes, a retired Marine lieutenant colonel and author of Marines Under Armor (2000), follows the 1st PMG from Operation Demon III at Camp Pendleton, Calif., its landing at Pusan and its baptism of fire at Masan to the two Battles of the Naktong Bulge. He contradicts the official Marine Corps history claim that the brigade's arrival saved the Eighth Army from chaos and panic. He points out that units of the Eighth Army were at 50–60 percent troop strength but still managing to secure the Pusan Perimeter, and that the Marine unit, at a more robust 90 percent strength, was one of five fire brigades that carried out counterattacks, while MAG 33 provided air support for all United Nations units as needed.The author concludes with the claim that during World War II American infantry units initially lacked the basic skills and motivation to engage Japanese infantry in close combat because their commanders expected artillery to do the work, to the point that such doctrine devolved into a dependency. The American soldier clearly faced the same problem when fighting enemy forces in Korea, but the professionalism and flexibility of the 1st PMG changed the rules of the game. Into the Breach at Pusan is an extremely valuable book on the "Forgotten War," with operational lessons worth remembering.—Thomas Zacharis Sorry to have been away so long and missed the earlier version of this thread! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 The review from Dec 2012 Naval History [Naval Inst Press], written by Col. Dick Camp, concludes: The Pusan Perimeter (1954) the first of the official history’s five volumes, thus embellished the role of the fire brigade and was deliberately self-serving, according to Estes. Yet, even though he attacks in no uncertain terms the “rhetorical excesses and exaggerations [that] have distorted the history of the Marine brigade at Pusan,” the author is also careful to point out that “the brigade’s accomplishments in Korea are in no way diminished by an accurate account of its operations.” Estes’ Into the Breach at Pusan is a well-written and researched book that persuasively challenges the lore surrounding the 1st Provisional Marine Brigade. I expect it to spark spirited discussion, and Ken Estes may well be advised to wear a flak jacket and helmet when the fire brigade’s conventional defenders come out of the bushes with “guns” blazing. Perhaps this is the effect of my rhetoric, with which Ryan has difficulties? Military History, had [Jan, 2013 online]: Into the Breach at Pusan shows that 1st PMG personnel entered the fray in Korea with a lack of wartime experience. Brig. Gen. Edward A. Craig was the exception that proved the rule. During World War I he had sent a telegram to his father, stating: "I'm entering the Marine Corps." The reply he received read: "Do not join the U.S. Marines under any circumstances. A terrible bunch of drunks and bums. Father." That attitude persisted among senior U.S. Army officers, such as General of the Army Douglas MacArthur, who in a conversation with Lt. Gen. George E. Stratemeyer called the Marine inferior to the common American soldier. Author Estes, a retired Marine lieutenant colonel and author of Marines Under Armor (2000), follows the 1st PMG from Operation Demon III at Camp Pendleton, Calif., its landing at Pusan and its baptism of fire at Masan to the two Battles of the Naktong Bulge. He contradicts the official Marine Corps history claim that the brigade's arrival saved the Eighth Army from chaos and panic. He points out that units of the Eighth Army were at 50–60 percent troop strength but still managing to secure the Pusan Perimeter, and that the Marine unit, at a more robust 90 percent strength, was one of five fire brigades that carried out counterattacks, while MAG 33 provided air support for all United Nations units as needed. The author concludes with the claim that during World War II American infantry units initially lacked the basic skills and motivation to engage Japanese infantry in close combat because their commanders expected artillery to do the work, to the point that such doctrine devolved into a dependency. The American soldier clearly faced the same problem when fighting enemy forces in Korea, but the professionalism and flexibility of the 1st PMG changed the rules of the game. Into the Breach at Pusan is an extremely valuable book on the "Forgotten War," with operational lessons worth remembering. —Thomas Zacharis Sorry to have been away so long and missed the earlier version of this thread! Well, welcome "home" Marine. From an ex-doc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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