Politicians to Watch For 2012, 2016

[Mike Steele]

....

 

*I know that a few people will say that he's always been that guy, but I disagree. Yes, he played the media darling for years, but at least he would stand for what he believed, or at least what I thought he believed.

 

The irony of this statement is palpable....

[Skywalkre]

Politics is an ugly business. I used to like McCain because he tried to actually find a middle ground and get something, anything, done. Now, McCain is just a political hack* who, hopefully, loses in his reelection bid.

I have no idea who the democratic challenger will be but J. D. Hayworth is hardly anything to wish for.

[Hittite Under The Bridge]

Democratic Senator Evan Bayh will not seek re-election this fall. Former Republican Senator Dan Coates is already on the ballot.

 

As I said in another thread, I'm suspicious of Bayh's next move. IMHO he would have pummeled Coats, even though polls right now show it as a close race. Coats isn't particularly well-liked within his own party for voting for the assault weapons ban in 1993 (?) and was taking major hits from both sides from his lobbyist days with ties to Hugo Chavez, Bank of America and Yemen. He was also getting criticized for not really living in Indiana for the past five or so years-even though he paid rent on a house in downtown Indy, satisfying residency requirements....but he was on the record saying that he preferred to live in North Carolina.

Edited February 16, 2010 by Hittite Under The Bridge

[JOE BRENNAN]

As for Palin's qualifications, on paper they don't appear any worse than Gore's, Kerry's, or Biden's. Or hell, Schwarzenegger's.

Maybe you mean that in your opinion in actual substance Palin is more qualified, OK, that's an opinion. Or, you might want to establish a new principal that less is more and people with experience in national government are tainted, but you haven't established that. *On paper*, by any past standard, where national and foreign policy experience is a very important qualifiaction for President, Gore, Kerry and Biden had so much experience as US Senators it's not plausible to compare them to somebody who worked in the home, was a small town mayor, and then part term governor of a small population state, even though those positions were executive. And when Gore ran for Pres, he was two-term VP. And Kerry was (on paper) a decorated war hero. It's ridiculous to claim they weren't more qualified, on paper, than Palin is. Likewise Arnold now, if he here eligible to Pres under the constitution, is obviously more qualified *on paper* as two term governor of a state 50 times the population of AK.

 

On paper, Palin has little qualification to be President compared to any of those 4 or the great majority of others in history nominated for Pres. by a major party. You can argue she transcends that, but that's the fact as far as paper resume. Obama in 2008 is another of the least qualified on paper. Problem is, the GOP would be putting itself in position of having to argue their candidate is no less unqualified in 2012 than Obama was in 2008, while pointing to Obama's failure in part because of his lack of experience. And, anybody (except a former President, like Grover Cleveland in his second win, or Teddy Roosevelt in his last run) is less experienced at being President than the sitting President, so a person with a shorter resume is at more of a disadvantage running against one than running for an open WH as Obama was.

 

Joe

Edited February 16, 2010 by JOE BRENNAN

[DKTanker]

See Dave, that's your constant MO. Take something and try and add to it, then try to make me own it. I never said that. Sarah Palin is a great person to have on your side in a race right now. She speaks to a segment of the Republican party. But, does that make her presidential materiel?

I added nothing to what you said and far from making you own anything, I merely asked a question. I do concede the question was asked in the context of you having, until this post, trashed Palin. As for Palin being presidential material, I challenge you to find even one post in which I stated or implied that Palin was or is presidential material. See, you did exactly what you accused me of doing.

 

Politics is an ugly business. I used to like McCain because he tried to actually find a middle ground and get something, anything, done. Now, McCain is just a political hack* who, hopefully, loses in his reelection bid.

 

 

*I know that a few people will say that he's always been that guy, but I disagree. Yes, he played the media darling for years, but at least he would stand for what he believed, or at least what I thought he believed.

Why do you hope McCain loses his reelection bid? He was good enough the last two decades, why the disenchantment? Edited February 16, 2010 by DKTanker

[DKTanker]

It's no praise of idiotic liberal attacks in media/entertainment to just admit Palin would be weak as a Presidential candidate. I just see them as a stopped clock that's right twice a day. The GOP can do better, that's all.

 

Joe

Who is this mythical GOP contender that could do better? Who is this better credentialed possibility that isn't afraid to take on the MSM and Obama? Personally I hope you're right. Realistically at this point I don't think any "credentialed" Republican has the balls to stand up and be counted.

[Ken Estes]

The Left has been obsessed with and deranged by Sarah Palin since she rose to national prominence in 2008. Not disagree, not poke fun at her, but obsession and derangement. There is simply nothing about her that ought to drive reasonable people nuts.

 

As for Biden, I'm not scared of him, I'm not obsessed by him, and I'm not deranged by him. I do think that he is a buffoon and doofus, which is harmless until the day (God forbid) when Washington, DC is a smoking crater and a shaken Joe Biden is sworn in as the 45th President, in which case we will have a buffoon and a doofus as commander-in-chief at the worst imaginable time.

 

As noted, she may be derided, but simply because she is so ridiculous. Sorry about that!

 

A Biden presidency ought to be feared, but mostly for the incipient boredom that would entail, much as a Kerry presidency in 2004, albeit much less damaging than 4 more years of the Bush'ia. As I have maintained for several years, the POTUS as CINC is not a problem in the USA, because of the talent residing in the funny shaped building across the river....

[Archie Pellagio]

Palin isn't going to run for any office, full stop.

 

If Palin is the republican nominee in 2012, I'll wear a chicken suit to that year's I&I.

 

She is a celebrity, she will spend her days raising funds, talking in simplistic folksy terms that get people predisposed to like her excited and she will do a lot to keep that part of the republican party happy.

 

She isn't ever going to hold another executive office.

[Old Tanker]

I have no idea who the democratic challenger will be but J. D. Hayworth is hardly anything to wish for.

 

Agree.

 

If I wanted to replace John it would be Jeff Flake not J.D. Flake is a budget hawk and ethics hawk and a non-PORKer. Boehner refuses to put him on the House Ethics Committee. Good ole N. Az. Mormon family roots.

 

J.D. listens to J.D. and J.D. only. J.D. isn't the budget hawk he pretends to be.

 

J.D. was the channel 10 sports announcer all through the '80s and was famous for flying into HS football games every Fri. night.

[Old Tanker]

The message the Tea Party types are pushing is any candidates top priorities must include the discriptor Budget Hawk and Deficit Hawk.

 

The GOP hasn't figured that out yet and of course the Dems are recently trying to pretend such is their style.

 

Brown and McDonnell are fiscal hawks but differ on social issues and others . But they fit the Tea Party mold.

 

Cheney recently approved of Gay marriage and dropping Don't ask , don't tell. That shows his western libertarian roots and he was always a budget hawk. His influence over Bush '43 was wildly exaggerated IMHO. His daughter Lynn is starting to be a GOP player in the heirarchy of the party.

Wyoming , Cheney's home state , was the first in the U.S. to give women the vote.

[FALightFighter]

IF we were fighting the bad guys other than rhetorically, I'd be impressed. The whole thing with the Republicans blasting Obama because of the underwear bomber just baffles me. It's equally as stupid as blaming Bush for 9/11.

Jim, I hear that excuse over and over again. IMHO, she still freaking quit. I don't like quitters.

 

I don't blame the president for the attack happening. He is SOLELY to blame for his appointed AG's pitifully stupid decision to Mirandize the turd. That decision, in and of itself, is evidence that the current adminstration doesn't "get it", and in fact, purposefully chooses to act in ways that are detrimental to our national security.

[m1a1mg]

I added nothing to what you said and far from making you own anything, I merely asked a question. I do concede the question was asked in the context of you having, until this post, trashed Palin. As for Palin being presidential material, I challenge you to find even one post in which I stated or implied that Palin was or is presidential material. See, you did exactly what you accused me of doing.

 

Why do you hope McCain loses his reelection bid? He was good enough the last two decades, why the disenchantment?

NO Dave, I asked you a question:

 

But, does that make her presidential materiel?

 

this is what you tried to attach to me:

 

So is it of your considered opinion that McCain should renounce the endorsement of somebody in over her head?

 

Notice the difference. You tried something and it failed. Had I said, So you think Palin is presidential material? , that would be similar to what you did.

 

My disenchantment with Mc is him becoming a parrot. I'm not sure why, but Bob Dole became more in step with the party after he lost in 96. Maybe it's penance.

[m1a1mg]

The irony of this statement is palpable....

You obviously don't understand irony.

Edited February 16, 2010 by m1a1mg

[DKTanker]

NO Dave, I asked you a question:

 

But, does that make her presidential materiel?

 

this is what you tried to attach to me:

 

So is it of your considered opinion that McCain should renounce the endorsement of somebody in over her head?

Two questions, the difference being the author. Your question implies that I do think Palin presidential material (I've never made a statement one way or the other). My question to you builds on your stated opinion that Palin is in over hear head. I will say this, Palin has shown much more class towards McCain than he deserved.

 

For the record, AZ and the US Senate could do worse than McCain, it could replace him with the brash and loudmouth Hayworth.

[Mike Steele]

Palin isn't going to run for any office, full stop.

 

If Palin is the republican nominee in 2012, I'll wear a chicken suit to that year's I&I.

 

She is a celebrity, she will spend her days raising funds, talking in simplistic folksy terms that get people predisposed to like her excited and she will do a lot to keep that part of the republican party happy.

 

She isn't ever going to hold another executive office.

What size do you take?

Edited February 16, 2010 by Mike Steele

[Mike Steele]

You obviously don't understand irony.

I understand you. That's enough.

[BP]

Palin quit. You can say it's because she wanted to spare her state endless lawsuits, but others in office have fought spurious lawsuits and still managed to be effective (even Clinton!). Hell, it's Alaska. There are fewer people in Alaska than in almost any major city, and most of them are self-reliant types who don't depend on their government for much. She could have at least kept the roads paved and emergency services operating- that's what I really want from my gov't.

 

She's not Ivy League, and that's perfectly fine. I think the Ivy League gang has done enough damage to this nation recently. There are tons of smart, willing and able lower tier university grads. However, as others have said, I would exect a smart state school grad to demolish a Katy Couric or some of her fellow newsreaders. She can't enunciate a position coherently, and clearly doesn't show the seriousness of preparation the positions she covets require. Reagan didn't have a perfumed academic pedigree, but at least he could clearly state a position.

 

She says nothing different than the standard two-party line of "invade the world, invite the world, in hock to the world". I hear nothing of substance about the endless wars, nary a peep about uncontrolled immigration (unemployment at 17.6% - hey, let's invite more ilegals!), and almost total silence uncontrolled budgets and crushing debts at all levels, lather, rinse, repeat.

 

Palin does get my vote for having the best porn spoof though, as I SERIOUSLY don't want to see one of 99.975% of all other pols.

[TSJ]

The future of America: right wing tea party membership

 

 

 

[m1a1mg]

Palin quit. You can say it's because she wanted to spare her state endless lawsuits, but others in office have fought spurious lawsuits and still managed to be effective (even Clinton!).

Mark Sanford is still sitting in the gov's chair. Shit, if he can still serve, anyone can.

[BP]

Mark Sanford is still sitting in the gov's chair. Shit, if he can still serve, anyone can.

 

Excellent point. And SC is only half as podunk and 6.53 time more populous than AK.

[Jeff]

That's what I'd say too if I was being politically correct wrt GOP base elements who like Palin (not picking on you, quoting your comment makes it shorter ). Same kind of vibe I get from my and OT's hero Charles K, kind of pulling punches on Palin not to piss off a segment of his audience. It's no praise of idiotic liberal attacks in media/entertainment to just admit Palin would be weak as a Presidential candidate. I just see them as a stopped clock that's right twice a day. The GOP can do better, that's all. Obviously it will only play out when we see if she wants to run, and how well she actually does in primaries/caucuses if so. But she's mainly a (*part* of the) base revver-upper when they should be plenty revved up by what Obama's done, there's the quitting thing (putting family first, immediate independent wealth available and with a special needs kid? I can respect it, but being Pres is about being 'all in' as a leader), and just not all that substantive on anything but the resentment-oriented rev-up. I just can't imagine she'd be their best shot. Somebody to watch for in 2012, but hoping not the GOP's candidate.

 

Joe

Once again, I'm not shilling for Palin. No one on the Republican side has grabbed me yet and any one of them will have to prove they can do the job and win the election. That's what the primaries are for. It's clear that Palin created a great deal of excitement on the right when she was chosen as VP candidate. McCain had to start doing his rallies with her to avoid the embarrassment of her filling arenas and him speaking to the chirping crickets. She obviously still carries that excitement today. Whether that fulfills my two criteria above, remains to be seen. Reagan had a lot of long thought and substance behind his political thinking, I don't see that yet in her. I think some Republicans take pleasure in taking cheap shots at her so they can prove to their friends and neighbors (and themselves) that they aren't like "those Republicans" The Republicans doing that would rather be patted on the head as the "reasonable minority" than take the slings and arrows necessary to win a majority. Bob Michael was a nice guy and got along with his Democratic masters in the House very well. That attitude was part of the reason the Republicans were the minority for 40+ years. Gingrich and the back benchers said "screw that" and took the Democrats head on. It's one thing to point out Palin's short comings or unknowns, but there is a real sense of disdain being cast at her by members of her own party before she has a true chance to rise or fall on her own. To be honest, while she can be exciting, I don't think she has it in her to do the job but I'll wait and see if she even wants to and I'll wait to see if she grows into the opportunity and proves me wrong. I won't throw shots at her dripping with arrogance or superiority. After Obama, people may be more inclined towards someone less charismatic but more capable than Obama. That likely isn't Palin.

[Tim the Tank Nut]

Jeff's point is good. Besides, we recently had "the dumb guy" who wasn't; the "smart guy" who isn't; and it's uncertain that the people/voters will want either of those two personality types in the next election. I'm a big Palin fan but to me she seems like a female GWB and I'm not ready for that again. I am grateful to President Bush for his security policies but his domestic policies didn't work out as well. Particularly in the last two years he seemed burned out. Palin's exit as governor makes it seem like she would be vulnerable to a similar scenario. If the President is working on things I support then I want them "on the clock" as much as possible, even at the end of a term.

[Old Tanker]

About a week ago many GOP'ers and talking heads including Rush were warning the GOP to not be trapped by Obama and to only talk after a clean slate is established on Healthcare.

 

Chicken !

 

Send 3 GOP'ers Dr. Coburn , Dr. Barrasso and Cong. Ryan. Let Ryan do the talkng.

 

Nobody has mentioned Ryan yet but he is gaining stature , attention and audience by challenging Obamacare and Obamanomics at every turn.

[Ivanhoe]

If I wanted to replace John it would be Jeff Flake not J.D. Flake is a budget hawk and ethics hawk and a non-PORKer. Boehner refuses to put him on the House Ethics Committee. Good ole N. Az. Mormon family roots.

 

I've never had a good feeling about Boehner, and this ain't helping.

[Jeff]

Nobody has mentioned Ryan yet but he is gaining stature , attention and audience by challenging Obamacare and Obamanomics at every turn.

Ryan is a good nuts and bolts guy but has his baggage (they all have some baggage). He voted for TARP and the auto bailout which may not sit well with the base and the tea party folks.

 

Questioning the trajectory of Rep. Ryan’s rising star

 

Paul Ryan explains his votes for TARP, bailouts and tax on AIG bonuses

 

You’ve got to remember Obama won my district. Dukakis and Gore won my district. Clinton won my district. So I don’t come from, you know, a red area.

 

Maybe not the standard bearer for a red party.

 

He might be a better OMB Director than the big cheese.