M60A2 question

[Doug Kibbey]

Doug Kibbey, what was your opinion of the gun/missile launcher system on the M60A2? How bad was the recoil when it fired?

 

Recoil on an M60A2 was insignificant compared to a Sheridan...but that's the difference between a "tank", and whatever label you care to hang on the Sheridan, at 17 tons. M60A2 had other problems, but they weren't related to excessive recoil.

[Doug Kibbey]

Ran into a Vietnam-era Sheridan PL a few weeks back, he swore blind he didn't have any issues with the 152 gun/missile combo, and that the problems are overstated.

 

Not sure what to make of it.

 

NTM

 

 

Issues on Sheridans in VN extended beyond the G/L system (and the Launcher system wasn't even complete or in use there). Am collaborating on unit history with last 2/11th CO in VN, and his view is less sanguine...he would have commanded about 18 at one time, given our TOE. I'm inclined to trust our collective experience, regardless of an isolated report, which may not be representative.

[Manic Moran]

It would be interesting if you could get him on TN.

 

No chance. He's a retired General working for a defense contractor, ran into him at the Armor Conference.

 

NTM

[Doug Kibbey]

No chance. He's a retired General working for a defense contractor, ran into him at the Armor Conference.

 

NTM

 

One of our former platoon leaders with whom we're in contact is a retired MG. Is your guy actually VN, or more precisely VN-era service?

[Corinthian]

Ran into a Vietnam-era Sheridan PL a few weeks back, he swore blind he didn't have any issues with the 152 gun/missile combo, and that the problems are overstated.

 

Not sure what to make of it.

 

NTM

 

 

There's a site out there which has a Guest Book and a lot of those who signed it were crew members of the M551. A lot of them swear at how bad the recoil was and the maintenance issues, while there were others who loved the tank. I signed it asking for info on a specific M551. Then I got an email telling me how screwed up I was thinking it was a neat looking vehicle. He told me how much he "loved" it (i.e., how much he hated it).

[DKTanker]

There's a site out there which has a Guest Book and a lot of those who signed it were crew members of the M551. A lot of them swear at how bad the recoil was and the maintenance issues, while there were others who loved the tank. I signed it asking for info on a specific M551. Then I got an email telling me how screwed up I was thinking it was a neat looking vehicle. He told me how much he "loved" it (i.e., how much he hated it).

Definetly a love hate relationship with the M551. A good vehicle to get around in and if you could limit yourself to either conventional rounds or missiles, but not both, it was a good shooting "tank" as well.

[shep854]

Was the Shilleleigh (sp?) considered workable during Desert Shield, or would it have been a case of "cross fingers and pull trigger"?

[Rocky Davis]

There's a site out there which has a Guest Book and a lot of those who signed it were crew members of the M551. A lot of them swear at how bad the recoil was and the maintenance issues, while there were others who loved the tank. I signed it asking for info on a specific M551. Then I got an email telling me how screwed up I was thinking it was a neat looking vehicle. He told me how much he "loved" it (i.e., how much he hated it).

 

If you were the TC, the main gun recoil was horrific. You had to brace yourself for the recoil at nametag defilade so that you could sense the round for the gunner and continue fire commands (and just try to “brace yourself” while holding binos up to your eyes with the right hand and having the left hand up to the left ear of the CVC helmet barking out the fire command to the rest of the crew). Of course, nametag defilade in a 551 meant being nametag defilade within the square armored box mounted atop the turret at the TC's station. For me, that meant that the small of my back was equal to the edge of the turret roof at the TC’s hatch opening. So, when I gave the fire command, and both hands were occupied as described earlier, one could not use the hands to “brace oneself” so one had to “brace oneself using other body parts (back, knees, etc.).

 

So, when the magic moment came to actually fire, and the first three roadwheels in the front lifted off of the ground during the recoil, the small of my back was thrust into the edge of the TC’s hatch opening – causing excruciating back pain and bruises. He we been issued body armor, I feel these injuries may not have happened, but we operated in our field uniform only with no body armor during 551 gunnery.

 

Just think of the fist time you ever went shooting a shotgun for the first time and how black and blue your shoulder was afterwards. That would be my lower back after main gun firing.

 

I loved the 551 except for when firing.

[Corinthian]

I am ignorant - nametag defilade?

Edited July 14, 2008 by TomasCTT

[Corinthian]

Was the Shilleleigh (sp?) considered workable during Desert Shield, or would it have been a case of "cross fingers and pull trigger"?

 

It was actually used in combat during ODS. Col. Sanders in his M551 spotted an Iraqi bunker. The missile was loaded already so they had no choice but to use it. Only documented instance of the Shillellagh used in combat.

[Rocky Davis]

I am ignorant - nametag defilade? Thanks in advance for explaining.

 

Armpits and above exposed.

[Corinthian]

Ah ok. Thanks.