European Army and Air Force 2012

[WRW]

Any thoughts on this - from the orbat, to weapon calibe, beret to left or right - my favourite is straight back - the food etc

[swerve]

Any thoughts on this - from the orbat, to weapon calibe, beret to left or right - my favourite is straight back - the food etc

 

We know what the heavy equipment would be, since it's all in service or on order.

[Xavier]

Any thoughts on this - from the orbat, to weapon calibe, beret to left or right - my favourite is straight back - the food etc

you know, a slightly more precised question would be nice to have...

 

You want to know how we think/wish a EU military would look like in 2012? in what context, how unified, etc

[WRW]

ok - should there be a standard TOE through out European countries in NATO

is ammunition standard? what about procedures

how compatible are logistics equipment

what about C4I compatibility

 

should there be a common family of AFV and logistics

likewise Air Force commonality

[Ariete!]

ok - should there be a standard TOE through out European countries in NATO

 

I think it would be helpful for there to be a set of STANAG armoured, ‘medium’ and ‘light’ TOEs at the Coy/Btn/Brig level that countries adhere to, absolutely. They can then still have the odd experimental or nation-specific unit as a form of innovation / local adaptation.

 

is ammunition standard? what about procedures

how compatible are logistics equipment

what about C4I compatibility

 

My impression is that they are still miles apart; especially C4I.

 

should there be a common family of AFV and logistics

likewise Air Force commonality

 

I think there should be more robust common procurement; if only to avoid diseconomies of scale. Tough to implement, though.

[WRW]

In the UK a major commands a company of about 110 men - please correct if wrong. What is it in the other armies?

 

Is the small arms ammo standard - what about the magazines?

 

Do people use the same 'drills'

[BansheeOne]

Despite all the visionary declarations by select political parties, we're a long time off from a common European Army, or even commonly organized and equipped European armies. It might well never happen, and I'm not entirely sure that's a bad thing. The EU Treaty as amended by the Treaty of Lisbon is limiting itself largely to unsubstantiated declarations of intent:

 

SECTION 2

 

PROVISIONS ON THE COMMON SECURITY AND DEFENCE POLICY

 

 

Article 42

 

1. The common security and defence policy shall be an integral part of the common foreign and security policy. It shall provide the Union with an operational capacity drawing on civilian and military assets. The Union may use them on missions outside the Union for peace-keeping, conflict prevention and strengthening international security in accordance with the principles of the United Nations Charter. The performance of these tasks shall be undertaken using capabilities provided by the Member States.

 

2. The common security and defence policy shall include the progressive framing of a common Union defence policy. This will lead to a common defence, when the European Council, acting unanimously, so decides. It shall in that case recommend to the Member States the adoption of such a decision in accordance with their respective constitutional requirements.

 

The policy of the Union in accordance with this Section shall not prejudice the specific character of the security and defence policy of certain Member States and shall respect the obligations of certain Member States, which see their common defence realised in the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation (NATO), under the North Atlantic Treaty and be compatible with the common security and defence policy established within that framework.

 

3. Member States shall make civilian and military capabilities available to the Union for the implementation of the common security and defence policy, to contribute to the objectives defined by the Council. Those Member States which together establish multinational forces may also make them available to the common security and defence policy.

 

Member States shall undertake progressively to improve their military capabilities. The Agency in the field of defence capabilities development, research, acquisition and armaments (hereinafter referred to as “the European Defence Agency”) shall identify operational requirements, shall promote measures to satisfy those requirements, shall contribute to identifying and, where appropriate, implementing any measure needed to strengthen the industrial and technological base of the defence sector, shall participate in defining a European capabilities and armaments policy, and shall assist the Council in evaluating the improvement of military capabilities.

 

(...)

 

6. Those Member States whose military capabilities fulfil higher criteria and which have made more binding commitments to one another in this area with a view to the most demanding missions shall establish permanent structured cooperation within the Union framework. Such cooperation shall be governed by Article 46. It shall not affect the provisions of Article 43.

 

(...)

 

 

Article 45

 

1. The European Defence Agency referred to in Article 42(3), subject to the authority of the Council, shall have as its task to:

 

(a) contribute to identifying the Member States’ military capability objectives and evaluating observance of the capability commitments given by the Member States;

 

( promote harmonisation of operational needs and adoption of effective, compatible procurement methods;

 

© propose multilateral projects to fulfil the objectives in terms of military capabilities, ensure coordination of the programmes implemented by the Member States and management of specific cooperation programmes;

 

(d) support defence technology research, and coordinate and plan joint research activities and the study of technical solutions meeting future operational needs;

 

(e) contribute to identifying and, if necessary, implementing any useful measure for strengthening the industrial and technological base of the defence sector and for improving the effectiveness of military expenditure.

 

2. The European Defence Agency shall be open to all Member States wishing to be part of it. The Council, acting by a qualified majority, shall adopt a decision defining the Agency’s statute, seat and operational rules. That decision should take account of the level of effective participation in the Agency’s activities. Specific groups shall be set up within the Agency bringing together Member States engaged in joint projects. The Agency shall carry out its tasks in liaison with the Commission where necessary.

 

 

Article 46

 

1. Those Member States which wish to participate in the permanent structured cooperation referred to in Article 42(6), which fulfil the criteria and have made the commitments on military capabilities set out in the Protocol on permanent structured cooperation, shall notify their intention to the Council and to the High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy.

 

(...)

 

http://www.iiea.com/images/managed/publica...ts/TEU_2008.pdf

 

 

The possibility for a permanent structured cooperation of members with advanced military capabilities is the one field where we may see closer integration:

 

PROTOCOL

 

ON PERMANENT STRUCTURED COOPERATION ESTABLISHED BY ARTICLE 42 OF THE TREATY ON EUROPEAN UNION

 

THE HIGH CONTRACTING PARTIES,

 

(...)

 

HAVE AGREED UPON the following provisions, which shall be annexed to the Treaty on

European Union and to the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union:

 

 

Article 1

 

The permanent structured cooperation referred to in Article 42(6) of the Treaty on European

Union shall be open to any Member State which undertakes, from the date of entry into force

of the Treaty of Lisbon, to:

 

(a) proceed more intensively to develop its defence capacities through the development of its national contributions and participation, where appropriate, in multinational forces, in the main European equipment programmes, and in the activity of the Agency in the field of defence capabilities development, research, acquisition and armaments (European Defence Agency), and

 

( have the capacity to supply by 2010 at the latest, either at national level or as a component of multinational force groups, targeted combat units for the missions planned, structured at a tactical level as a battle group, with support elements including transport and logistics, capable of carrying out the tasks referred to in Article 43 of the Treaty on European Union, within a period of 5 to 30 days, in particular in response to requests from the United Nations Organisation, and which can be sustained for an initial period of 30 days and be extended up to at least 120 days.

 

 

Article 2

 

To achieve the objectives laid down in Article 1, Member States participating in permanent structured cooperation shall undertake to:

 

(a) cooperate, as from the entry into force of the Treaty of Lisbon, with a view to achieving approved objectives concerning the level of investment expenditure on defence equipment, and regularly review these objectives, in the light of the security environment and of the Union’s international responsibilities;

 

( bring their defence apparatus into line with each other as far as possible, particularly by harmonising the identification of their military needs, by pooling and, where appropriate, specialising their defence means and capabilities, and by encouraging cooperation in the fields of training and logistics;

 

© take concrete measures to enhance the availability, interoperability, flexibility and deployability of their forces, in particular by identifying common objectives regarding the commitment of forces, including possibly reviewing their national decisionmaking procedures;

 

(d) work together to ensure that they take the necessary measures to make good, including through multinational approaches, and without prejudice to undertakings in this regard within the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation, the shortfalls perceived in the framework of the ‘Capability Development Mechanism’;

 

(e) take part, where appropriate, in the development of major joint or European equipment programmes in the framework of the European Defence Agency.

 

 

Article 3

 

The European Defence Agency shall contribute to the regular assessment of participating Member States’ contributions with regard to capabilities, in particular contributions made in accordance with the criteria to be established, inter alia, on the basis of Article 2, and shall report thereon at least once a year. The assessment may serve as a basis for Council recommendations and decisions adopted in accordance with Article 46 of the Treaty on European Union.

 

http://www.iiea.com/images/managed/publica...tocols_2008.pdf

 

 

Nothing of this will have happened by 2012, though.

[Hans Engstrom]

There are some interesting things happening, not elast the above mentioned EDA, but for the on the ground reality, one could look at the cooperation between certain specific nations. One part I'm interested in (obviously) is the enhanced level of cooperation between Sweden, Finland and Norway.