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Main Gun Ammo - Revisited


Jim Warford

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  • 3 weeks later...
So does that picture substantiate the rumor that latest Chinese 125mm round is longer than what the original Russian autoloader is able to handle?

386817[/snapback]

 

IMO - No.

Compared to the tank soldier holding a round is 165-175cm high and round is ~ 1/3 of his height - so 55-60cm would be reasonable.

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  • 1 month later...
  • 5 months later...
So...

 

How much would a penetrator cost? Just to put on the mantel...

NOT DU! :) just a penetrator.

oh well, I probably couldn't afford much more than a cup of coffee right now. :(

 

I have a couple on my mantel, non DU of course. :)

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  • 1 month later...
Here's an interesting pic of a South African Oliphant MBT taken in 1988 with Israeli M111 ammo. While it's hard to say with 100% certainty (based on the quality of the pic)...we do know that South Africa got M111s eventually.

 

Shot at 2007-08-29

 

It does really look like M111 and some M111 like rounds are on display in South Africa (Armor Museum IIRC), together with something which looks like the following DM33 series. ExT-70 surely can add more info! IIRC correctly these were known as APFSDS round MkI and MkII

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It does really look like M111 and some M111 like rounds are on display in South Africa (Armor Museum IIRC), together with something which looks like the following DM33 series. ExT-70 surely can add more info! IIRC correctly these were known as APFSDS round MkI and MkII

 

Olifant (looks like Mk1) being bombed up with what was called the FS Mk1.

 

SADF did not use "internationally known designations", but it seems to be commonly accepted that the so- called FS Mk1 is/was a M111 clone (remember close SADF/IDF relationship during that era). The rounds were as far as I know locally manufactured.

By the late 80's the FS Mk2 became available, which had a longer penetrator and was found to become unstable in flight at about the 2000m mark. We only got to play with the Mk2 a couple of times due to the "problems" in accuracy and penetration. (sounds familiar?) Were told that the Mk2's problems were fixed (called the Mk3??). Never saw one (if it existed) as they were apparently war reserve and not to be used in training (at that stage also close armour ties between SADF and WGermany).

 

Mk2's were not expected to have problems in Angola as the fighting distances were extremely short. T's were being taken out as close as at 50m range. So, whoever fires first survives. So you train some more. And then some.

 

Mk1 did apparently not have any problem penetrating T34, 54, 55 and 62's. Later Mk's were meant for what might come.

 

Pic below were taken at AAD06 and for some reason I labeled it FS Mk1 (it was not labelled). Looking at it now the penetrator looks longer than I remembered for the Mk1. Might even be a later mark. But time plays strange tricks on the mind.

 

Finer details of weapons were never discussed. You learnt what was needed to know to operate it, but the details were never mentioned to crews or us then jnr leadergroup. Remember this was in the middle of the arms boikot. Semi sophisticated items like engines, sights and APFSDS rounds were just "there". You were discouraged to ask where they came from.

 

Edited by exT70
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