Old Tanker

Rightfully so the USAAF's and the USN's procurement proceedures was to give aircraft developement seed contracts to numerous sources which operated their own competive engineering depts driving competition and technical advancement.

During the standoff at Ch. Pt. Charlie in Oct. '61 the 10 or so M-48s kept their engines screaming most of the times. That's alot of heavy noise enclosed in a city block or two. They must of refueled every 2 hours or so if they kept those gas hogs screaming.

Being raised a Christian I take a positive position on it for a few of reasons. Mainly the good influences of Moses , Jesus , Peter , Martin Luther , John Calvin and John Wesley. In more modern times Sister Teresa and Billy Graham. I also recognize the bad resulting from Evangelizing with the sword and gun. Sometimes the difference is following or interpretation of the Old Testement vs. the New Testement gets carried to far by both political and religious leaders. The Ten Commandments play a strong role in my basic make up but not the only influences involved. My ancestors were a mix of Calvinists and Hugeonauts.

Comparing maps of 1860 and 2010 for political comparisons is one way to view current politics but I'd be more incined in showing Right to work states compared to closed shop states as a modern political divider. Watch out...the Obamaites will attempt nat'l card check as they owe it to Trumpka and those of his ilk.

These debates over Lib vs. Cons. miss , by a long shot , the libertarian influence or stance. The 1st,2nd and 4th Amendments have nothing to do with a modern LEFTY/Progressive or an 1850s Conservative but are true libertarian values. The ACW was fought over libertarians issues All men should have the right to own property and earn wages for their labor. Confusing an 1850s Liberal with a 2010 LEFTY is flat wrong as is ignoring the libertarian ideology existing in the U.S. then and today. In 1850 the libertarian influence was greater in the north . Today the libertarian influence is greater in more rural parts of the country being the South and the Mtn. West.

I cited the source. You're free to question and criticize any study, of course. In fact it's even welcomed, by definition. But to counter evidence you'd need evidence, or to show that the evidence collected is somehow invalid or inaccurate. Part of the problem might be that in US usage the terms 'liberal' and 'conservative' have become so twisted that they've almost lost their original meaning. Supporting universal healthcare is not 'liberal' - supporting same-sex marriage is (example). Likewise supporting small government is not 'conservative' - supporting a traditional marriage is. But I'm merely trying to find out an explanation to why a) there's such a strong correlation between the educated states and their support for Obama / Democrats, and why the support for GOP may be eroding, as some here have argued it is. That study simply fits on both accounts, though it certainly is by no means an exhaustive explanation for either. Do you have a better explanation? Huh? Where's the racism, the xenophobia, any reference to "untermenschen", let alone calls for extermination of any part of the population? Interesting that quoting the Bible and calling for Biblical morals gets no such response, but cite a study from a scientific publication and get called an indoctrinated liberal Nazi who lives in a silo. Go figure. Where did I call you a NAZI...don't mix it with my conclusion that you live in a silo. I never call a Lib a NAZI, not my style or ways , I prefer the term Neo-Marxist.

And your explanation for why higher education correlates so strongly with liberal values? "Indoctrination"? ELITEISM ! Along with nearly totally existing in isolated silos or bubbles. An education should give you the background to observe , research and measure or evaluate input and experiences. Your comment about Romney and the Bainy thing show you lack any personal research or observations skills being applied. Therefore I conclude you exist in a silo.

Romney wasn't a moderate. Not by a long shot. He was way off to the right, pandering to the religious nutters and with a pretty bad history with the whole Bain thingy. Not exactly a recipe to attract secular middle-class independents. Not to mention the fact that he was Mormon, pretty much guaranteeing that no black man would vote for him. Explain Romney pandering to religious nutters. Explain to me not in LEFTY talking points but in the weeds what's negative about the Bain thingy .

We have 63% say don't raise taxes but I recall polls with higher numbers for "don't cut Medicare, SS" etc. So what we have is "63% say don't raise MY taxes but I'm ok with raising taxes for the guy who lives in that mansion up the road and drives a Mercedes" ..and it's been that way since dirt was new and always will be ....it's called class envy or warfare.

IBD claims the U.S. Center Right is stronger than ever. Data in point. * 1980 32% claimed Cons. * 1996 33% Cons. * 2012 35% Cons. * Libs = 24%. * 40-45% consistantly claim Moderates. Gov't doing too much. * 43% 2008 * 51% 2012 * 63% say don't raise taxes.

Debating Simpson-Bowles. Obama hid SB under the WH bed and now he hints about dragging it out and dusty it off . I think that SB is good but many GOPers don't like it because ObamaCare was hands off during the discusssions. LEFTY doesn't like it because it tones down Class-warfare and a LEFTY cannot function in politics without class-warfare. Obama had one month to push through SB as Dems controlled both houses but he was afraid of his own party plus he doesn't really like SB for my stated reason. Today The First LEFTY will make comments about the economy and the Fiscal Cliff about noon or so.

Mitt was done in by the class-warfare card started by fellow GOPers in the primary season salted by the angst of the EC againist Mormons. Well before Mitt was the declared the defacto winner ( Feb-Mar) the Dem machine took off on the Mitt attacks quite readily and building on the GOP rival Bain game. Next time LEFTY also will have a blood letting frenzy with an 8 year lousy recovery head wind to deal with. Can LEFTY still blame Bush after 8 years ?

Both parties are loaded with social conservatives as the black, Latino and Roman Catholic practioners are mainly social conservative blocks in the Dem party. But in the Dems they don't control the platform as is done in the GOP. IMHO all social conservatives are pro-big gov't. The difference between the 2 parties is it's admitted in the Dem party but not in the GOP. Bush was pro-big gov't but within GOP guidelines . However I cannot see belonging to a party that has both the majority of Muslims and Jews belonging to it .....something just doesn't fit except the term sheeple.

The problem with Bush's plan was the border was basically wide open and to be left wide open while the debate and passing of legislation went on. Remember the Republican Elites liked immigrant labor to work in McDonald's , the car washes and mow lawns. As a staunch Republican I have to start the blame on the GOP , not the Dems or the other party as do the Dems. But start with the GOP as I had no leverage or influence on LEFFTY.

When it comes to illegal immigration Bush dropped the ball. All that was needed was to make a valid attempt to seal or secure the border and then discuss , debate and legislate the issue. The GOP base took Bush's reluctance to seal the border as 1986 Amnesty 2.0 ( Reagan Amnesty). ITMT , the Dems turned it into a RACE issue which they started to do about 1978-9 and run very well with it.